Robert Irizarry

As far as a supplier for epoxy and fiberglass (or carbon fiber for that matter), check out the site for Jamestown Distributors. You can get a better idea of the stuff that's out there and they have a forum as well. Not to take this off topic, but WOW! I started checking out some of the stuff like hyunsu's pine guitars and they are amazing. I'm sure some of the other stuff in those threads will also be exciting. I'll have to do some further digging but I can already see what is going to inspire my next hundred or so topic posts.

Thanks for the input on the finish. I'm not completely married to the idea of a wipe on finish. However, while doing some research on finishing alder I came across many examples of its use in furniture and cabinet making so I'm guessing its relatively sturdy stuff. If anybody else has input on alder I'd appreciate it. I'll make sure to practice. I wouldn't want to get that far and then ruin it. It would be enough to bring me to tears. Well, maybe not tears. Maybe more like - Oh and thanks for the compliment on the template. I was REALLY surprised at how well it came out considering my COMPLETE lack of experience with anything resembling woodworking. I was smiling from ear to ear for the next hour and then every time I thought about it over the next few days. To test the template, I traced the shape onto paper. Looks good. Of course the next challenge will be to not mess up during the routing. Oh and thanks for the advice on taking my time. It seems like I've been at this idea for a long time when I honestly only started thinking about it in early January. I'm trying to appreciate every step of the process and so far I am.

Hey thanks. I think you're the first to say its a nice design. (Just kidding folks. I'm far more thick skinned than that.) Funny question that you ask about the last name -this is the second time this has come up on the board. Let's see - um, not that I know of? How's that for an answer? I guess I'm not the only one who thinks its an unusual last name. Until high school, the only Irizarry's I knew were family and there weren't that many. High school was the first time I encountered an Irizarry that wasn't family (to the best of my knowledge). Since then, I've encountered or heard of quite a few. The name is of Basque origin and it would seem that the Irizarry males have been far busier than I originally thought. Heck I'm the oldest of seven and my dad had three adult kids from another marriage by the time I was six or so - a total of TEN in all! I, on the other hand, have not kept up with tradition...

Really nice work - I really like that upper horn too. I'd like to see more about the bass...

Thanks for the comments. Right now I'm going with the Steinberger licensed bridge I already have on my Hohner. That is my limitation on going thinner than 1.5" without having the tension mechanism sticking out the back. Once I get past this build, I'll be looking at coming up with an original design and incorporating a fixed bridge like the ABM headless bridge. As to the Adrian Legg guitar, I thought it was interesting that he went with what essentially looks like the Klein shape with a conventional headstock. I think the key dimensions to consider are the degree of right arm support, the width of the body and the shape of the lower bout and I'll be looking toward those when I get to trying to be original.

Pete: I'm here to learn and I appreciate a thoughtful discussion - I did not take offense nor did I consider it a rant. I will follow up with a closer look at the Reverend guitars. Thanks for pointing out the construction techniques. I am interested in alternatives materials and construction. I don't think that will ever go away. Right now, everything is a learning experience with regard to building a guitar and I enjoy entertaining alternatives. Note the quote in my signature. Thomas Edison and the laws of chance say that I stand a chance of a good idea if I have lots of them - kind of like giving enough monkeys a whirl at a typewriter. Eventually one of them will write Shakespeare. As to the pickguard, I'm interested in it for two reasons. The first is aesthetics. Despite what might have come across in my initial post, I like a good looking form just like any other red blooded male. My thought was that a pickguard could add some visual interest to an "unusual" form and my choice of alder which is a relatively plain wood. I want to go with a wipe on type finish (for simplicity) and thought a pickguard could help. The second reason is that it is a highly practical approach. I can botch a few pieces of pickguard material and I'll only be out a few dollars. I can also route a bit more wood under the pickguard and lose a bit more weight in the process. However, if I botch my body blank, I'll probably cry. Thanks!

Here's my template on 1/4" MDF. Not bad for a first go at a jigsaw, rasp and files. I obtained the plan from the Guild of American Luthiers Plan Page which had a Klein solidbody harp guitar full size plan available. I simply deleted the harp. Please ignore the slight schmutz: The body blank is on order from Mammoth Guitars. Douglas has been VERY helpful. I hope to have it in the next couple of days.

Rob - I'm new at this too and had a heck of a time coming up with information on how to start. There are a number of approaches to getting your design onto the template material for example. One person recommended taking the full size drawing, rubbing some kind of ink or pencil on the back, laying the drawing face up on the template material and then tracing over it so that the ink/pencil on the back transfered onto the template material. This, btw, didn't work for me. It also introduced the vagaries of tracing. My approach was much simpler. I took my full size drawing, rough trimmed out the body and used spray adhesive to stick the drawing right on the template material. I used 1/4" MDF. You can get this stuff from an office supply place or a crafts place. I recommend applying the adhesive to the template and NOT the drawing. I suspect the drawing will wave and curl since the adhesive is wet. I applied a good coating of it, gave it a few seconds to start setting up and gently smoothed the drawing onto the MDF. Don't just plop it on there. Begin from one end and smooth down a bit at a time. If you have some small bubbles, you can probably work these out with your fingers or a rolling pin but the key is to take your time laying it down to avoid this. I let this dry for several hours (actually days in my case - I didn't have time to take on the next step right away). Done correctly, the paper will survive quite nicely through the next set of events. This might also be important - I had the plan on a single sheet of paper. Some print out sections at a time and then put them together. I'm not sure that this would work so well. I'd be concerned about all the spots where sheets came together. I don't know where you are but I was able to have Staples (office supply store) make me full size prints from my original for only a couple of dollars each. Next up was the jigsaw. For this step, I turned off the orbital function and used a fine tooth blade to ensure a smooth cut. Make sure to clamp down your work! Don't try to do this freehand. Also, don't leave too much of the work sticking out because it will bend under the weight of the jigsaw and you want to make sure to keep the jigsaw as flat to the surface as possible. Again, go slow and stay just outside of the lines - 1/8" should do fine. More is ok. Don't get hung up on this. Just keep in mind that you don't want to mess up the lines by taking out a chunk and you don't want to leave so much material that you are rasping and sanding for days. Keep rotating your work exposing only a portion at a time to work with. Keep in mind that the jigsaw will not take on sharp turns. Depending on your design, you'll need to make some relief cuts so that you can get close enough to the line without taking a sharp turn. Also keep in mind that the jigsaw blade will bend if you force it. Next is the sanding. I used a combination of a four in 1 rasp and a sanding block to do this. GO SLOW and clamp your work as before. While sanding, keep in mind that you want the edge to stay perpendicular to the top surface. The last thing you want to do is tear into a line and leave a gouge. I had a couple of small nicks but they were inconsequential - I was able to work them out without visibly compromising the design. Start with the rasp's rougher surface and switch to the finer surface as you get closer to the line. Sand smooth when you are practically there. Typically, I've heard to sand the line off so that's what I did. I had NO experience doing this and despite this I got very good results. It will take time. Make sure you have it and make sure you have no distractions. It will make this go easier. As I mentioned, I used MDF which I liked very much. It works easily (be careful not to take off too much) and smooths nicely. However, keep in mind that it doesn't like to get wet although normal air borne moisture is fine. Mattia had a good idea in taking this template and making a sturdier one out of plywood with a pattern bit and router. I'm not at that point though. From one newbie to another, I hope this helps. BTW - Here is my template ready to go (please ignore the bit of schmutz):

I'm still debating this a bit. I'm looking at one of three possibilities - rosewood, walnut or just plain black. What I'm looking for are any tips or considerations when staining alder. After some additional digging around searching out alder furniture, I think I've found my solution. I have to remember these guitar things are made of wood...

Thanks, Mickguard! You gave me exactly what I was hoping for - suggestions on a shape and thus a path to pursue. I also appreciate the comments on pickguard aesthetic. Not being a connoisseur of the pickguard, I turned to its greatest defender for help. "Help me Obi-Wan Mickguard; you're my only hope!" I agree with both of you. The Ovation design does a nice job of working both the form and function aspects of the equation. Being my first build, I'm not quite ready to begin with my own design. I was able to obtain a plan for the Klein and it made sense to begin with this concept, explore it as it is and then branch out later. I've already been thinking about ways to come up with my own design that incorporates a blending of Ovation style and Klein function. Right now, I feel the need to establish a baseline of sorts, see what works and doesn't work and proceed from there. I've been thinking about how to minimize weight in a future design as well. I would definitely consider chambering. Also, a future design would incorporate a fixed bridge which would allow me to go even thinner with the body. Again, for my very first attempt I wanted to keep it simple since I have no established skills. This first build will hopefully help to develop the skills I'll need to work toward implementing something original. And, yes, forearm contours and belly contours are part of the equation (the Klein also incorporates these). I don't deny their value. I just don't think they are the only part of the equation. As I've mentioned before I owned a Strat and the overall package didn't deliver on the comfort level I was looking for - particularly the "angled neck-strings-bridge axis, which as you stated, "make a whole lot of sense."

Hi Laban: Did you do a search using the forum's search feature? Doing so with ACAD as the search term results 3 pages worth of topics that reference ACAD drawings. Among these are references to sites where you can download. I point this out to help not to chastise. I'm a newbie myself but I've already come to realize that one of the big complaints from the old timers is that newbies ask their questions without looking first. Its a valid issue. I've seen examples of this in just the last couple of weeks. I'm not suggesting this is you. I would rather assume that you were not aware of the search feature and point it out. All that said, you can find lots of "ACAD" drawings (aka .dwg or .dxf files) at http://www.guitarbuild.com/modules/mydownloads/. Dig around. There's a good amount of stuff. BTW - These are more commonly known as just CAD drawings. Good luck on the forum. Its a good place with good people.

I'm still debating this a bit. I'm looking at one of three possibilities - rosewood, walnut or just plain black. What I'm looking for are any tips or considerations when staining alder.

Hey Nitefly - what exactly is this stuff you saw at the auto store? I know that in wooden boat building, you would use fiberglass coated in epoxy resin to create extra strength. Done correctly, the stuff is practically transparent.

In the short time I've been on the board, I've already learned to appreciate your input on other topics I've started. This is no different. I agree that aesthetics and function do not need to be mutually exclusive. In fact, I like nothing more than to see them combined. I can already see forward to another project and you're right - it will probably have a more traditional form. I've already been toying with the idea. For now, I'll be exploring this form to see where it takes me. As to the Hohner headless, its actually a neck through design so unfortunately, I can't use the neck. But I think I can leverage it as a test bed for future ideas. Thanks! Now can I get Mickguard to suggest an appropriate pickguard shape for this thing?

There sure is and I'm going to leave it alone as well. Like I mentioned, its a love it or hate it kind of design. I fall more on the side of function as far as guitars are concerned. There's a certain "elegance" to a functional design. Note I said "elegance" and not necessarily "beauty". I will say this much though - As far as women, I like them pretty, smart and a bit difficult. My wife has been keeping me on my toes for six years.

It isn't the same as the old Ovation but its hard to deny that it wasn't an inspiration for the designer Steve Klein. Ultimately, very few things are truly original. That said, it doesn't diminish the design and the improvements to balance and general comfort. Yes. However, the lower bout is quite different and that is part of what makes it better balanced. I'm sure the lack of a headstock and tuning keys also helps.

In terms of designs, I have an interest in both ergonomic guitars and headless designs. I’ve done a lot of research and the Klein Electric is one of the more ergonomic designs out there. Here is an example (not me, btw): The body balances well both standing and sitting. It is particularly suited for playing in a sitting position because the neck naturally falls at an angle. It also provides substantial support for the right arm. Unfortunately, an original is largely out of my reach for two reasons. First, its builder has been incapable of keeping up with orders. There are people now waiting two or more years according to a number of posters to the Klein Electric Guitars Group over at Yahoo.com. Second, even used ones are fetching $5000. That’s about $4999 more than I currently have. Therefore, this brings me to my first project attempt. I’ve decided to attempt to recreate one. The primary inspiration for this goes to Jason Fink who showed it was possible. More recently, Francis Lannie began a similar project and has shown good progress. The following are my major considerations in terms of the direction of the project: 1. Simplicity – I’m a big believer in “form follows function”. Some would say I’d have to be since the Klein shape is one of those love it or hate it designs. I also have little in the way of woodworking skills so the KISS (keep it simple stupid) principle is in effect. 2. Low cost – I have Fender Lace pickups already lying around from a long defunct Fender Strat Plus. I will also “borrow” the Steinberger licensed bridge from my Hohner headless. 3. Ergonomics – Apart from the shape itself, I’m also looking to keep weight down. To help meet this goal, I decided on a 1.5” thick alder body blank. I would have gone thinner - I love the Black Machine super thin guitars - but I’m limited by the depth of the Steinberger licensed bridge. As far as specifics, I’ve decided to go with the following: 1. Alder body 1.5” thick 2. Bolt on neck – I’m not building the neck. 3. Fender Lace pickups in neck and bridge position 4. Control layout - Single volume, single tone and 3-position switch with a guitar face mounted output jack. 5. Wipe on finish – I’m considering tinted Danish oil or just black shellac like Myka’s beautiful work as seen here: http://www.mykaguitars.com/instruments/031/default.htm. I'm leaning toward black. I love black. Not only does it go with my minimalist approach, it also goes with my wardrobe. 6. Headless design – I’ll use a Kahler behind-the-nut locking clamp (rather than the standard headpiece seen on Steinberger designs) on a regular neck converted to headless duty. For Mickguard’s sake, I haven’t ruled out a pickguard BUT I haven’t come up with a shape I like. The standard Klein pickguard doesn’t work for me. If I’m going to commit to a pickguard, then the knobs, pickups and output jack (conventional type not a strat type) should all mount to the pickguard. The standard Klein layout is a combination (I would say mish mash) of both pickguard and rear routed forms. It has to be one or the other. I welcome all comments and suggestions. I’m particularly curious about your thoughts on control layout and appropriate pickguard designs/layouts. Wish me luck...

I was actually going to ask you about that. I was totally seeing that and I think it will work well. Have you done a mockup yet to test the idea?

What a great job! I love seeing stuff like this. Apart from the quality of the work, its encouraging to see how nice a first build can be! I'm so close to committing to my first build...

You've probably seen these - tables that have a thick clear coat that holds embedded objects or pictures. That's epoxy. That would work but I have no idea what it would do to the tone of the guitar.

One of the complaints from the old timers is that newbies are not searching before posting. I completely agree with this and leveraging Google's search functions adds another tool not only for the newbie but for the experienced.

Hey Scott. Curious - would you happen to have a pic of your stand you could share? Thanks.

Great tip! Google is so much better a search engine than what is typically available on a site and this is a great tool to use in conjunction with a search using the Project Guitar Forum search function. In keeping with this tip, here's another way to do the same thing. 1. Go to www.google.com 2. Enter your search parameters in the field 3. After your search parameters, enter "site:" followed by the site you want to search against. For example, if you want to search for the term "tutorial" on www.projectguitar.com, enter "tutorial site:www.projectguitar.com" (Leave out the quotes) Notes: 1. To search the main site, specify projectguitar.com. To search the forums, specify projectguitar.ibforums.com. 2. It won't be completely up to date since Google has to go through and do its indexing. 3. Google returns results based on its estimation of relevance so results will not be in chronological order unlike results returned from Project Guitar's Forum search function. 4. My unscientific test shows that the Google based search returns some February content and it seems to pull up stuff that I hadn't pulled up through the Project Guitar Forum search function. My suggestion then is to use these in combination with each other. The result will be greatly improved search results.

Being a bit older, I'm definitely paying a lot of attention to my conditioning and form. I've been stretching regularly but I agree I should incorporate strength training as well. I've also found that I focus better. What I didn't accomplish as a 20 something year old, I've been able to accomplish as a 30 something year old - a newfound focus on guitar, the near completion of my college degree, and even a successful marriage (my second go round). So, yes, there are some advantages. Lessons is something I also need to address as well. Right now, I'm working from a couple of books and videos and they have been helpful. However, I can definitely appreciate the importance of benefiting from an instructor. thanks for the great input!

Very interesting... I'll have to explore this when the time comes. Thanks!