mistermikev

probably an unpopular opinion (I have a lot of those) but I like it most flat.

also... if you are a true perfectionist... after you get it to the point where it looks good... the next step is to loath it and see flaws that are invisible to almost everyone else!

4 hours ago, ZekeB said:

Cleaned the inlays a little

i literally can't tell if that's just sitting on top, or is actually inlaid.  if inlaid - you did a great job!  if not: get to work!  really looks great.

2 minutes ago, curtisa said:

Nope. That's also a perfect task for CNC. Protoype PCBs are nothing more than fancy engraving jobs, and there are several free solutions floating around for taking gerbers and generating milling code.

good to know.  that would be huge for me.  no more dangerous chems and tedious drilling of holes!

5 hours ago, curtisa said:

By a process known as tiling. The fretboard gets attached to a substrate that has some locating pins milled into it that allows it to be moved forwards and backwards by a known amount. The fretboard gets milled in two halves by first attaching the substrate into key position 1 and milling the first section of the fretboard, and then moving it forwards to key position 2 for the second half of the job.

I wrote a series of articles on the process for Projectguitar some time back which can be found in the Articles Section of the website. There are also other articles where I documented my experience with one of those cheap Chinese mini CNCs.

The other way you can employ a mini CNC is to use it to create router templates rather than directly milling something. Cutting a pickup cavity into a body is impractical on the mini CNC as it either won't fit on the bed, or the spindle won't cope with the deep cuts required. Milling a pickup cavity router template out of 1/4" MDF however is perfectly achievable. That opens its usefuness up by a significant margin, as you can now make cavity covers that precisely match a template, create a series of interlocking custom templates for a Floyd Rose trem cavity, drilling templates for multiscale bridge assembly, or mill a scratchplate out of blank pickguard material etc

ahhh, I could see how that could work.  very cool.  will have to go read through those threads. 

I could see a lot of things that could be done there, control cavity covers/templates, smaller pickguards... also I do a lot of prototype pcbs and would love to automate the drilling of holes.  I imagine you could even forgo etching and route the pcb traces... but that actually might be too much precision/work.

thank you so much for the wealth of info.  you are a real resource here.

4 hours ago, sprack said:

You can do it in the vicinity of $1.5k. I'm just in just a little over $2000 USD in the hole with a Shapeoko XXL + accessories.

CAD/CAM in Fusion360. Remote controlling it via a raspi 3+ with CNCJS, which I found much easier than LinuxCNC.

 

thank s for the info.  your workshop is impressive clean/organized!

3 hours ago, Norris said:

Congratulations

thank you Norris! 

10 hours ago, Andyjr1515 said:

Well deserved win against very strong competition.  Congrats!

I agree... lets here it for @ADFinlayson 's build.  Some strong competition there.

1 hour ago, Lwguitar said:

Congrats on the GOTM!!! 

It was a hard month to vote with both guitars being so awesome!

I couldn't agree more.  We were both talking behind the scenes while we watched the lead being passed back and forth.  Had I lost I would have been honored to have lost to such a fantastic build.

no idea... but I'm hear for support! 

my experience with wood is there can only be a ltd win in terms of fighting it.  you could try to plane off some wood on the wet side to hopefully get it to release some moisture.  adding water to wood seems dangerous as you don't know what way it's going to go and it could get worse.  Ultimately, I think with something like this you just have to give it time, see where it ends up, and then shape it.  I'm sure there are folks with more experience on this topic as my approach has always been to not fight it... so I'll let the fighters advise.

the closer one looks a bit more 'standard'.  also the far one seems to be the non locking, no?  have never used one but apparently they work for guthrie govan.

4 hours ago, curtisa said:

I'd actually suggest that for the small items you've nominated it is entirely possible to do it on a budget CNC. I got started on a prefab Chinese kit from eBay, a CNC3020. The model number just refers to the rough dimensions of travel; in this case 30cm x 20cm. From memory it was under $700AU at the time, but for more money I could've gone with bigger models - CNC3040, CNC6040, CNC9060 etc. They all tend to be pretty similar in terms of quality, construction and implementation. I used the 3020 unit for several years and had it do fret slotting and inlays just fine. To be fair though, that's pretty light duty work and probably all that you could expect for such a small, cheap machine. It certainly couldn't cope with milling metal or deep cuts in timber.

The drawback to going with a cheap all-in-one unit is that sooner or later you will run into its limitations - the cutting area will eventually be too small, there'll be too much runout in the spindle, the frame and gantry will flex too much. steppers will be too weak, spindle can't take the bit you're wanting to use, not enough vertical travel etc. And if you want to venture deeper down the CNC rabbit hole, you'll invariably outgrow the basic unit and have to shell out extra for either a more mature kit or build your own. The $3K figure that @MiKro suggests is probably about what you'd plonk down for that 'tier 2' unit.

The software will also require a significant investment on your part in terms of training and time. You're essentially looking at working in three or four different headspaces concurrently - Computer Aided Drafting, 3D Modelling, Computer Aided Manufacturing and Motion Control of the CNC hardware itself. Some software packages attempt to integrate the lot. Others will only perform one or two of those functions.

There are other options regarding software for the CNC. Freecad has integrated CAD, 3D modeling and CAM elements and is constantly being expanded and developed as time goes by. Being open source it is free, and for the most part it does the job. Make of that what you will . At the low-cost end of the market QCAD has decent built-in CAM capabilities and has a much better implementation of CAD than Freecad currently has, but is strictly 2.5D at this stage. Although to be honest, on a small CNC machine you probably woudn't attempt any true 3D milling anyway.

For actually driving the CNC you only have a couple of options - Mach 3/4 ($$) or LinuxCNC (free). Having gone down the LinuxCNC path I actually wouldn't recommend it to absolute beginners as it can be an absolute pig to get working and the support for it is somewhat lacking. If you're used to working with Linux computer environments then you may get along with it OK, but I've personally found it's implementation, usage and technicalities pretty, well...Linux-y.

If you have moderate DIY electronics skills, what does seem to be a good entry point into the CNC motion control system is the use of an Arduino running the GRBL firmware. I don't think there are any decent fully-fledged CNC kits that use it yet, so you'd have to retrofit it intoyour own hardware, but for basic XYZ CNC open-source machines it is an attractive alternative and has a lot of things going for it if you don't need the complexity of LinuxCNC or Mach.

some great info there - thanks for that.  how did you do fretslots on something that is that small?  I guess if you lied diagonal it was just enough space?  either way, that'd be beyond my expectations... looks like a good option for getting in the door.  $500 and I could build a linux box to control it.  would have to dust off my linux shoes but that'd probably be good for me.  man pages don't scare me.

I see the machines you mention on evilbay.  something to dig into there. 

A wealth of info here and a lot to digest, will have to go do some research on a few of these techs.  Thank you for the responses!

29 minutes ago, MiKro said:

An xcarve is crap in my opinion. Now that being said that does not mean you cannot do what you want with it. It will require a lot more sanding on your part and don't expect it to be super accurate. As far as hobby licenses, no, many do have educational license though. Fusion 360 is free from Autocad. Vectric does have Cut2d, it is a very basic 2d CAD/CAM and around $300. Some use Easel which is a 2d cad it is cranky at best.

Thank you very much for your input.  I def appreciate it. 

ok, so xcarve is no good.  is it better to buy a kit an assemble yourself, otherwise can you do a light recommendation afa "just something to not expect much from but a good introduction tool"?

28 minutes ago, MiKro said:

Mike to get started plan on about $3000 min.  I'm sure there may be some cheaper but I would not trust them to be accurate enough to do inlays. The only free CAD/Cam is Fusion 360. it is online based and the learning curve is very steep. It will do 3D as well as 2D but again very steep learning curve. Plan on about a year, maybe 6 months if you are working at it 5 to 6 hours a day.

mk

well altho discouraging... I appreciate the advice.  If I may ask a few follow up q's?  so... I understand one can get a larger x carve that is big enough to do a body in the $1500 range... so these are no good?

afa learning curve... I'm sure it would a challenge, and take exactly the time you mentioned... but if I could do it a little at a time I think it would be fun and worth it.  It has taken me years to learn photoshop/gimp, even longer to learn SQL... but with both I was able to do some basic handy things pretty quick... I expect fusion might be similar?  also, are any of the 'hobbyist' licenses worth looking into?

46 minutes ago, ADFinlayson said:

Congrats dude, it’s a very nice guitar. If you’ve finished blond, we could do battle again in June. En Garde!

kind of hoping for disaster as opposed to that! ;)

31 minutes ago, Stu. said:

Congrats on the GOTM win!

Thank you Stu.!  Means a lot to me atho I'd like to formally acknowledge that I'm very lucky to have scraped thru against the formidable @ADFinlayson!

so I've been thinking a lot about getting my feet wet w cnc.  I'd like to learn to do 3d design, but w/o a way to realize the design it seems a bit futile.  Not looking to take over the world, but would like to be able to dip in my toes and accomplish some small things.

goals:

cut inlay from blanks, cut corresponding inlay channel

make knobs

make pickup covers

budget: I guess I'd like to know what a realistic budget for a small cnc setup is... but is $300 enough to get a small machine?  I could probably spend more, but not looking to invest a lot at this point.

I know I've seen a few threads from @Prostheta here, but have some specific questions and would like recommendations.

1) can you recommend a cnc machine?  don't really want to build as not mech inclined... but am inclined on the computer side.

2) free cad/cam program?

3) thread recommendations?

1 hour ago, Lwguitar said:

The base plate will have a keyway that goes in the slot and a sliding nut under the base plate to tighten the saddle down. There will be an intonation adjustment screw on the front of the saddle. This thing will be a pain to install and adjust!

The idea behind the design is to have a bridge that is extremely smooth and comfortable and also looks good. I had to cut corners on ease of adjustment and manufacturability to meet my cosmetic and comfort goals.  

I like your design, that's a great idea and afa I know not a lot of focus in the marketplace on the issue of palm comfort.  I have always hated the vintage style strat saddles for this reason... so unfomfortable.  the gotoh vs100 I have is fairly decent as long as you have the saddles adjusted up a bit so the hex screws don't poke through.  I have a babicz that is about the best thing I've felt in terms of comfort.  I take it you are milling in the compensation for radius?  

nice work... this will a pretty innovative build and looking fwd to the finished pics. 

be honest... you just are too lazy to wind the pickup all the way (hehe).

wait, you don't mean you are putting a tube in the guitar?  that'd be cool... maybe a nutube (korg).  sounds like some interesting stuff... going all bill lawrence on yer pickups.  should be fun to see this come together.

I had a friend/co-worker ages ago, who had a vintage melody maker... he took it and put a lovely burl top on... then put p90s in it.  looked a lot nicer after.  guitars were meant to be played... and once a guitar steps away from being all original... might as well go as far as you like.  just my o.

no expert here but honestly i think a decent level will do the trick.  just has to be straight.  in my humble O there are so many things that can make more of a difference than a .0001 accurate beam... for instance when you polish your frets after spending the time to level them with a super accurate beam... you probably do more damage then you would do by using a beam that isn't quite as accurate.  furthermore, playing the guitar instantly wears down the frets.  unless you are gonna level them every month I don't think it will matter.

I play with my action super low... literally laying on the frets, so I guess I would know pretty quick if my frets were less level due to using a $25 level... hasn't bothered me yet.  my advice would be to buy a decent level and some 3m spray glue and some belt sander belts.  or as some here have done, buy some angle iron and do the sm. 

12 minutes ago, Chuck_Chill-Out said:

I was using a jointer to smooth out a piece of cherry. The wood kicked back and as I readjusted it, I focused on my right hand instead of my left, which was closest to the point of operation. My finger drifted off of the wood and laid alongside it, pushed the moveable guard away from the blades, and shaved off the tip. 

I should have used a planer. My hands would never have been close to the blades on it. 

thank you for that.  thank you for sharing that.  probably saved some people with your story.  scary stuff.  I guess you got pretty lucky getting a doc that appreciates guitar!  here's wishing good things for you going fwd.

this might work... it's hard to say.  you may have issues with the string rubbing on the saddle since the bigsby might sit too high to properly receive the string... but it's hard to say w/o trying.    looks like a fun build.  Love me some tele and my next build is going to be a thinline style with a tremking - which i hope is a nice sub for a bigsby.   I love the feel of the bigsby on my 295.

anywho... looking fwd to seeing pics

50 minutes ago, ADFinlayson said:

I like that lead tone, reminds me of Greg Howe's sound 

thank you ad.  I actually thought it was sort of 'carlos'.  I recently got a triaxis and have been struggling to dial it in.  Still needs some work but admittedly I didn't spend enough time setting levels here either.

w no cab sim... the triaxis tends to be a bit harsh and my podhd - can't run cab w/o amp so... now I need a new fx processor!  I have actually been looking at my crazy pedal collection going "I almost never use that vintage boss dm-2 or that h&k rotosphere... I could do w/o those".  So probably do some pedal videos in the near future... could use the practice anyway.

I actually read your story - I think over at talkbass or perhaps tdpri?  I had reiterated it here at the time as we all need reminders of how quickly things can go south... even when you are fully concentrating.  It def sharpened me.

I very much appreciate you sharing your story because who knows how many accidents it has and will prevent. 

If you don't mind me asking... would you elaborate on what exactly happened?  I don't have a jointer, but I think in the interest of prevention it would be helpful. 

I think I read over there, that you are pretty well recovered, and able to play?  If so - I'm very glad, if not - here's to your speedy recovery.

22 minutes ago, Lwguitar said:

Nope, not a tune-o-matic. It’s my own design, here are some pictures of a prototype saddle.

The plan at this point is to use my wife’s sowing machine and double sided tape! Haha

I’m going to get some sort of cheap counter off amazon.

ah, I think I may have seen this earlier (terrible memory here... probably Alzheimer's ).  looks like it might have some sort of string locking mechanism?  looks like the bottom may slide along a screw hole for intonation? 

it will be interesting to see this come together.

btw... totally looks like a mini airstream or streamliner!

just a thought, but direction of the router and quality of the bit would probably play a big role in preventing this.  downhill routing works wonders altho I have never worked with palmwood and am not certain it could be avoided.  all that said: multiple passes at small depths and a big (3/4") router bit with a bull nose have served me pretty well in figured wood scenarios.

there's only one guaranteed way to avoid it and that would be one of those guided sanding drums.

(note to self: avoid palmwood!)