extremecustoms Posted August 20, 2003 Report Share Posted August 20, 2003 This is my first post here, although I lurked for a while - Yeah, as the topic says, I am refinishing my Warlock bass guitar, and eventually going to restore it completely... It's currently finished in a bright red color, which has a good bit of little scratched over it... But all that is going to change. This is my first time to consider such a feat really, and I came here for moral support, and to ask some questions. I am in the autobody and repair biz on the side, and we do little stuff for people, and it goest without a hitch... How different from auto work is this guitar painting? Also, I was wanting to go with something a little radical at first, but I think maybe I shouldn't try to go big my first time out. So I thought it over, and I like the satin black finish that I've seen on some guitars - (ex - Epiphone Gothic series). I think that I may end up doing that on this one to keep it kind of simple. I have a small fracture, (maybe just in the finish) on one of the bottom sides of the bass, how do I go about repairing this so that it won't be noticeable and won't interfere with my refinishing project? I am seriously considering ordering 2 more basses, (if all goes well) in the next week or so... So I am excited right now to say the least. I put this into the knowlegeable people's hands who are pros at what the do... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
extremecustoms Posted August 20, 2003 Author Report Share Posted August 20, 2003 Or maybe I should do it black with some kind of tribal ghost flames or something? Is there a stencil or something??? I guess satin may be too hard??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drak Posted August 20, 2003 Report Share Posted August 20, 2003 Maybe these will give you a few ideas, maybe give you a few ideas of what NOT to do! Here are 3 pics of my Warlock madness, FWIW. First is just the raw body, which is solid one-piece Ash that has been chambered out on both sides (like a 335 I guess) and a Lacewood top added. Second is the stained version. B*tch still ain't done yet! I may add that this finish wasn't 'good enough' for me (idiot!) and I stripped it off and stuck on a Coco-Bolo top, along with routing a Floyd bridge cavity for it. Well, sometimes Coco-Bolo looks great, and sometimes not. This was one of those times. It still has the Coco-Bolo top on it, but it's coming back off, and I think I'm going to put another Lacewood top on it. I should have left it alone...(sigh)...Oh Well! HaHaHaHa!!!! Raw Lacewood Topped Warlock Blue-Stained Warlock ...And this is the way it looks now (like steaming pile...) seemed like a good idea at the time... Coco-Bolo Warlock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cr_XD Posted August 21, 2003 Report Share Posted August 21, 2003 woooowwwwww, amazing finish man. is that only blue stain??? it´s amazing!!!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drak Posted August 21, 2003 Report Share Posted August 21, 2003 This was my 'recipe' for the blue Lacewood... 1) Regular old 'stain black then sand back' routine. I normally use Behlens' Black Solar-Lux Alcohol stain for this. It is darker black than any other black I can make... 2) Then, after sanding back, Bleach the top. The Lacewood is a light brown, and I needed it to be really light/white to accent the blue. Blue over brownish wood looks like 'Dogpile Dinner Dee-lite'. (Secret here) 2-part bleach only reacts to the natural colors of the wood, it doesn't affect anilyne dyes (well, maybe a leedle bit, but really not much) ...So you can bleach the natural wood colors out over top of your anilyne dye and not effect the anilyne dyes already applied. I learned this trick from 'thoroughly' reading the 'Finishing Bible', 'Understanding Wood Finishes' by Bob Flexner, the best book in the business if you ask me...when it comes to wood finishing, Bob is Jesus...he explains all the myths, all the hype, all the facts... 'Cause if you bleach 'First', then stain black then sand back, you will wind up with uneven surfaces, as the bleach doesn't penetrate all that deep, and as you are sanding back from the black, the surface will wind up uneven, as some parts will remain white, other parts will go back to the natural light brown, so I wait to bleach until I have done that part of it. Then I (wipe-on) apply the blue, and my blue recipe is usually the Stew-Mac water-based blue mixed with the Stew-Mac Metallic Blue. After experimenting with both, I find that I like a 'blend' of both for my favorite blue hues. Although on some (maybe most?) occasons I will drop in a few small dabs of red, and I think I might have done that on this one (done years ago, I can't remember!) as it does have a very slight 'purplish' tint to it. That's pretty much my 'M.O.'... If you didn't bleach, the brown of the Lacewood would ruin any blue you tried to go with. It would wind up being 'Suck-Ass Blue'!!! HAHAHAHAHHA!!!!!!! That's why Maple is so great, it's damned near white to begin with most of the time... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted August 21, 2003 Report Share Posted August 21, 2003 Sweet looking Drak extremecustoms welcome if you haven't been greeted yet and there is no reason why you can't use the exsisting paints your already using on the car's. It's just a matter of figuring out what finish from what product. When it comes to templates well a .89 piece of posterboard come's in handy and a razor blade to cut it out once you have it drawn and an airbrush helps too of course unless your a wizard with a standard gun. The satin jobs can be done by using a flat clearcoat and regulating the spray a little more. Your lucky because you probably have access to not only guns but some sort of drying booth so you can experiment with a scrap piece of 2x4 while doing the other jobs the difference is small in the end because the application is basically the same (your just starting off with a wooden base instead of steel). Just do the prep work the way you normally would. Have a look at the Finishing section here in the forum we just found out the make and type of paint from DuPont that PRS is using.............. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
extremecustoms Posted August 21, 2003 Author Report Share Posted August 21, 2003 Wow thanks guys, and I must say that the blue warlock up there is really an awesome job... I'd definitly have been satisfied with something like that as my finished product... I ain't all that picky. So as you (Brian) say just use a flat clear- what color should I use under that? Because the Gibson gothic series isn't a deep black satin, it's a more black with a gun metal gray tint with the flat clear coat over it... Or is it just a normal black that looks different under the flat clear coat? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
extremecustoms Posted August 21, 2003 Author Report Share Posted August 21, 2003 OH! And also, do I need to add any adhesion or flex agents into the paint to support them? I know on cars with plastic or fiberglass parts, we have to use both, because the stuff dun like staying on if ya don't use them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted August 24, 2003 Report Share Posted August 24, 2003 This was my 'recipe' for the blue Lacewood... 1) Regular old 'stain black then sand back' routine. I normally use Behlens' Black Solar-Lux Alcohol stain for this. It is darker black than any other black I can make... 2) Then, after sanding back, Bleach the top. The Lacewood is a light brown, and I needed it to be really light/white to accent the blue. Blue over brownish wood looks like 'Dogpile Dinner Dee-lite'. (Secret here) 2-part bleach only reacts to the natural colors of the wood, it doesn't affect anilyne dyes (well, maybe a leedle bit, but really not much) ...So you can bleach the natural wood colors out over top of your anilyne dye and not effect the anilyne dyes already applied. I learned this trick from 'thoroughly' reading the 'Finishing Bible', 'Understanding Wood Finishes' by Bob Flexner, the best book in the business if you ask me...when it comes to wood finishing, Bob is Jesus...he explains all the myths, all the hype, all the facts... 'Cause if you bleach 'First', then stain black then sand back, you will wind up with uneven surfaces, as the bleach doesn't penetrate all that deep, and as you are sanding back from the black, the surface will wind up uneven, as some parts will remain white, other parts will go back to the natural light brown, so I wait to bleach until I have done that part of it. Then I (wipe-on) apply the blue, and my blue recipe is usually the Stew-Mac water-based blue mixed with the Stew-Mac Metallic Blue. After experimenting with both, I find that I like a 'blend' of both for my favorite blue hues. Although on some (maybe most?) occasons I will drop in a few small dabs of red, and I think I might have done that on this one (done years ago, I can't remember!) as it does have a very slight 'purplish' tint to it. That's pretty much my 'M.O.'... If you didn't bleach, the brown of the Lacewood would ruin any blue you tried to go with. It would wind up being 'Suck-Ass Blue'!!! HAHAHAHAHHA!!!!!!! That's why Maple is so great, it's damned near white to begin with most of the time... okay dude,help out a finishing idiot please. what do you mean by 2 part bleach? and will this bleaching method work with mahogany? i am building a guitar out of crotch mahogany(a really nice piece)and i really don't like the natural color of mahogany.i am thinking that if i use your teqnique but with red in place of the blue it would be pretty nice looking. by the way that lacewood was magnificent!i have never seen a top so 3d. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drak Posted August 24, 2003 Report Share Posted August 24, 2003 Yes, you can do that, but if you're -not- doing a 'stain black then sand back' (which I don't think you would be with this) routine, then you should just bleach it first before you do any dying. I have done what you are talking about to some Crotch Walnut that was stunningly beautiful, but just too dark. I bleached it, then stained it with a slightly reddish toner, came out great! The 2-part bleach is made by Klean-Strip and is simply called Wood Bleach, and is pretty easy to find, and it will bleach that mahogony just fine. It contains 2 pint bottles, you take a mixing cup and mix them together in equal parts in the mixing cup just before you apply. One bottle is peroxide, I can't remember what the other part is... It helps a bit to wet-wipe the wood, let dry, and lightly sand first tho, 'cause it will raise the grain... It doesn't go down that deep, so if you don't like what it did, you can just sand for awhile and you'll be back to square one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted August 24, 2003 Report Share Posted August 24, 2003 all right.thank you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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