Hector Posted November 13, 2007 Report Share Posted November 13, 2007 here's another one, I didn't take many pictures in the beginning but here's some that I took today. more pics here. specs: mahogany back and mahogany top. (the back is denser than the top) mahogany neck. Rosewood FB duncan JB and 59 pickups. gotoh tuners. dots inlay or no inlay at all. all black hardware. The idea was to do a replica of the prs standand satin stain all the mahogany black. but I wanna try to finish it with oil. Don't know how stains and oil finish go together. any ideas? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattharris75 Posted November 13, 2007 Report Share Posted November 13, 2007 I've used black stain under tru oil, and it works great, no problems. Give it a try, should look cool! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hector Posted November 13, 2007 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2007 I might change my mind on the finish! check this out! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackdog Posted November 14, 2007 Report Share Posted November 14, 2007 (edited) I might change my mind on the finish! check this out! Looking good !! Mahogany looks terrific in natural. May I ask why you used a separate top of the same wood as the body ?? Edited November 14, 2007 by Blackdog Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattia Posted November 14, 2007 Report Share Posted November 14, 2007 Welcome to the Natural Finish Mahogany fanclub. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xanthus Posted November 14, 2007 Report Share Posted November 14, 2007 Welcome to the Natural Finish Mahogany fanclub. "Proving that you don't need AAA figuring to get the clearcoat." Looking good, Hector! What was the decision to do 2 pieces of mahogany? Is it chambered inside or something? And a rosewood fretboard to boot! That's going to be one mellow guitar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WAK Guitars Posted November 14, 2007 Report Share Posted November 14, 2007 I've used black stain under tru oil, and it works great, no problems. Give it a try, should look cool! I've heard in a book somewheres that tru oil finishes take a little bit of the bite and treble out of the sound. Is this true? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hector Posted November 14, 2007 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2007 (edited) thanks guys, I used 2 pieces of mahogany because I can only get mahogany that is 4cm thick. to do a carved top, with prs dimensions, I had to use 2 pieces. the body is not chambered at all. solid! and the funny thing is the difference of the 2 pieces, the back one, is the best mahogany I've ever seen. very dense. heavy as a rock. and the color is dark red. and the top is the exact opposite. light, not dense and kinda orange. I got both pieces in the same place. and paid the same price for them. one thing a luthier friend taught me is to look for the pieces with lots of mineral deposits on the pores. the more, the better. he grades his mahogany in 3 grades. the worst one is " hairy" because well, it is hairy, doesn't sand of plane well, not very dense but sounds good. " normal" is everything that falls in between the 2 other categories, and the "export" grade is this dense wood, with mineral deposits on the pores (a white stuff, i'm gonna take some pictures later) and he says this one sounds awesome and makes some pretty amazing instruments. here's what I did today. this one is going fast! new pics here Edited November 14, 2007 by Hector Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xanthus Posted November 14, 2007 Report Share Posted November 14, 2007 Wow, really amazing work on that neck! All of the mahogany pieces look really nice, and very clean too. Thanks for the tip about mineral deposits, I never heard that one. If one piece is heavier and denser than another, I would want to use that as the top wood, because the bridge will be going on it. It might brighten up the tone, but it's just me. You can't do anything about that now, obviously Nice work on the tuner countersinking too, I'm going to end up doing that to my build as well. What method did you use to go about doing it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattharris75 Posted November 15, 2007 Report Share Posted November 15, 2007 I've used black stain under tru oil, and it works great, no problems. Give it a try, should look cool! I've heard in a book somewheres that tru oil finishes take a little bit of the bite and treble out of the sound. Is this true? I have no idea, but I'm guessing unless you're talking about an acoustic guitar, this would be voo-doo. Even then it's probably quite minor. Anyway, Hector, what kind of finish is that on the test piece? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hector Posted November 15, 2007 Author Report Share Posted November 15, 2007 believe it or not, the finish is spray can PU. lol! and that is after just one coat. I chose the denser piece to be on the back because I considered the guitar as a whole. and by that, the mass of the back is probably more than 80% of the total mass of the body. so I thought that it would be better for the tone to have the nicer piece of mahogany as the larger part of the instrument. don't know if it makes any sense or not. And the countersink I made using a forstner bit first and then used a brad point 10mm drill to go all the way. using the centermark of the forstner as a guide. worked almost perfectly, now the problem is to find a wrench that fits in there to tighten the damn thing. I might have to make my own. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xanthus Posted November 15, 2007 Report Share Posted November 15, 2007 I really should have done it your way, but I didn't know what the diameter of the countersink needed to be. So now my holes are drilled all the way through. I'm just hoping that I won't have any issues with the e and B tuners, so I won't have to sink them. ::EDIT:: You could solder two thin pieces of metal onto each jaw of the wrench, kind of like a duck bill. That should give you enough grip to turn the nut. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WezV Posted November 15, 2007 Report Share Posted November 15, 2007 I have two mahogany neck through blanks in my workshop, both exactly the same in every dimension and they look extremely similar. One weighs 2.5Kg, the other is 4.5kg - no other appreciable difference between them.. Anyway, both me and the customer agreed the lighter one was the better choice. Weight is an important factor when building a guitar, both of these will make fine sounding guitars but one will be more comfortable!! I do not buy into the 'heavier wood sounds better' argument, its clearly not the case with ash and one of the things older LP's are praised for in most cases is the lightness of the mahogany. One of gibsons biggest problems at the moment is making guitars that are not too heavy which is why they are adding chambering to a lot of LP models. I suppose everyone has to decide whats most important, for me it goes 'weight, tone, appearance, cost' - obviously that is assuming the lightweight wood isnt going to sound bad, but out of two equal pieces of wood that will both sound good i will always go for the lighter one anyway, this looks cool - i would definately go with the natural finish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xanthus Posted November 15, 2007 Report Share Posted November 15, 2007 I was thinking more along the lines of density, Wez. My thought process said that an all mahogany guitar is going to have a very mellow sound > Les Pauls are mahogany except for the maple cap > maple is denser/heavier/brighter than mahogany > why not use the denser mahogany for the top, it might brighten the sound a bit. I dunno if the difference would have been appreciable, but it was an idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hector Posted November 15, 2007 Author Report Share Posted November 15, 2007 (edited) hey wes, I don't think that heavy is better either, but in this case it was. just because as xanthus said, all mahogany guitars can sound mellow. and after tapping both pieces, the denser one sounded better for what I wanted. It was much brighter than the other piece and to me, it would work better in this particular case. for this particular guitar. as an acoustic builder I learned to always tap and listen well before using any wood, and not make my choices based only on visual aspects of the wood. I do have other boards of mahogany that are lighter, both in weight and in color, and they sound awesome. they plane, sand and finish nice just as this denser one, but the board that the top came was not as good as I would like. I'm gonna take some pictures soon. Edited November 15, 2007 by Hector Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattia Posted November 15, 2007 Report Share Posted November 15, 2007 It's a piece by piece thing. I've got some fairly dense, solid Khaya (African Mahogany), for example, that's wonderfully stiff, great for necks, rings out like nobody's business. It's still lighter than maple, but it's got the right mass where it needs it. I've also go lighter weight honduran that has a great tap tone, and lightweight bodies, ditto. But I've also come across lightweight pieces that were floppy, thuddy, and no way was I going to buy those. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hector Posted December 7, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 7, 2007 started carving the top more pics here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackdog Posted December 7, 2007 Report Share Posted December 7, 2007 started carving the top more pics here Looking great !!!! Are you going for 24 frets or will you cut down the FB to 22 ?? Will the neck tenon be exposed, then ?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hector Posted December 7, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 7, 2007 Looking great !!!! Are you going for 24 frets or will you cut down the FB to 22 ?? Will the neck tenon be exposed, then ?? hey blackdog, I will cut down to 22 frets, there's actually 23 frets slotted on that FB. the neck tenon will be exposed, maybe I'll glue a piece of mahogany that matches the top to make it less obvious, or maybe I could highlight it like the santana model does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackdog Posted December 7, 2007 Report Share Posted December 7, 2007 (edited) Looking great !!!! Are you going for 24 frets or will you cut down the FB to 22 ?? Will the neck tenon be exposed, then ?? hey blackdog, I will cut down to 22 frets, there's actually 23 frets slotted on that FB. the neck tenon will be exposed, maybe I'll glue a piece of mahogany that matches the top to make it less obvious, or maybe I could highlight it like the santana model does. The way I see it: If you're gonna do it, do it right !! Definitely do the Santana thing. Or the early PRS thing: Same one Another If uncle Paul was proud enough to show off the deep tenon, then why shouldn't you ?? Edited December 7, 2007 by Blackdog Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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