Burl Grain Direction

[avengers63]

I'm I figure doing some small woodworking projects involving burl veneer. I'm having trouble discerning the grain direction on the burl in the pics I've seen. I only want to use the stuff that's HIGHLY figured, so it's prety hard to tell which direction the grain is going for sanding purposes. Any suggestions?

[Mattia]

Uh, by defintion, burl doesn't HAVE much in the way of grain direction. It swirls, knots, dives, turns, in every possible direction.

[avengers63]

Is that to say that it wouldn't matter which direction it's sanded in?

[fryovanni]

Is that to say that it wouldn't matter which direction it's sanded in?

I think he is saying, it won't help to look for a direction to optimise your sanding, because it has totally random grain (no direction to reference). You will have bits of runnout all over the place, so be careful with it (very delicate stuff). I love the look of lace burl, great stuff!

[wohzah]

I would say that to reduce scrathes that would happen from going against the grain, use 10 grit lighter sandpaper than you would normally, and add an extra finish sand with maybe 300 grit to make sure.

[joshvegas]

I thought you used a scraper on veneer infact I know you do i read it in a very old book!

not to say sanding won't work of course but scrapers are perfect for burled wood if they are nicely sharp they'll leave a really smooth finish in alot less work!

Edited April 8, 2008 by joshvegas

[Mattia]

Only if you really, really sharpen the scraper well and know how to scrape. I prefer sanding burls.

[joshvegas]

you scrape like this don't you?

diagonal

opposite diagonal

straight

I know mine is sharp because i slipped off the edge and sliced my hand!

I've never tried it on a burl but I HATE sanding with a passion i react to the dust.

[MiKro]

So can someone explain how you sharpen a scraper? I mean the cutting edge on a scraper is a burr. It is rolled over from a clean edge. So how do you suppose to sharpen it? That's a new one me and I've been using one for more than 30 years????????

I take mine when the edge won't pull a good curl and flatten the sides, then I draw a mill file across the edge to square it up to the sides. After that I use a hardened burr tool and draw it across the edge at an 80 degree angle to the sides to draw the metal up from the edge. At which point I then begin to roll that back approximately 10 to 15 degrees toward the sides. There is NO sharpening to a scraper.

What am I missing here? Are you using a different tool than I am? Must be or you are doing something wrong? Not sure?

I'm not trying to B!tch anyone out here, I just want to clarify the semantics of what's being said and what's being done.

As far as burl wood, or any figured wood, A good scraper with the proper burr works wonders, and is most times better than sandpaper. I personally shape my necks using a scraper. I have better control of the amount of wood I remove vs a spokeshave. I know that i will usually remove approx 1/64th of an inch on every pass that my scraper covers. I enjoy having a scotch and sitting out working a neck down to shape in the afternoon.

Mike

[Mattia]

Sharpen's perhaps a bad word, but burnishing it well takes a bit of practice. You can work with a really rough, squared filed hook, but that'll tear out. A consistently turned edge isn't quite as simple as it sounds.

I use scrapers for necks, top carves, all sorts of things, but I generally power sand burls, which I mostly use for rosettes.

[MiKro]

Sharpen's perhaps a bad word, but burnishing it well takes a bit of practice. You can work with a really rough, squared filed hook, but that'll tear out. A consistently turned edge isn't quite as simple as it sounds.

I use scrapers for necks, top carves, all sorts of things, but I generally power sand burls, which I mostly use for rosettes.

Okay Mattia I'll except that . I knew you knew better and BTW thanks for the kind words on the OLF about the "When its a dead project" !!

and yes burnishing a scraper does take some practice

Mike

Edited April 9, 2008 by MiKro

[jmrentis]

I've always just used the word sharpening as it seemed an easier explanation than burnishing. Sharpening has always seemed close enough of a description to me, though if someone viewed the word sharpening as something beyond creating the initial hook then I can see the problem with the word. My use of the word probably came from when researching burnishing techniques as many of the videos and articles I went through when learning went by "Sharpening a scraper" or something similar. As both you Mattia said, probably not the best word for it though.

It truly does take plenty of practice to get nice curls with a scraper. At first I always ended up with only managing to scrap dust, but as time went by and my burnishing technique improved, I was able to pull some nice curls. I still play around with the angles when burnishing to try different variations to see what differences I find. I really do think hand tools are a blast once you can properly tune them and produce sharp blades for planes and spokeshaves. I still need to find myself a higher quality rasp, I've wanting to find one for a while. J

[joshvegas]

Sharpening a scraper is totally correct the method for sharpening the scraper is burnishing.

It's funny I have never had much trouble sharpening (whoops) a scraper (it's about the only thing i can do quite well)

when i say i sliced my hand i just mean it cut a small but clean cut rather than gouging a lump out which is what would happen if it did have a "sharp" edge.

Edited April 15, 2008 by joshvegas