Newbie making a Custom P-bass of sorts, need components help!

[CC1]

Hello

 

First timer.

 

I've taken on building a bass for a friend as a present after I found some lovely Ash

 

I've designed and made the body (a modified Gibson SG-inspired style), and sought a neck from ebay

 

I now need to take the plunge and buy all the wiring and components. I need to do this, so I know exactly how deep to route the cavities etc, and I need to know that to move the making of the body forward.

 

From limited research (being only a guitar player myself), I've arrived at the following conclusions:

 

- The bass is 32" scale, not enormous. The spacing on the nut the neck came with is 30mm E-G (whole neck nut width at nut 41-41.5mm). I understand that the size and type of Bridge I buy is going to be important for playability, but struggling to find the method for figuring out the size bridge I need (as some don't seem to be horizontally adjustable).  Do I just need to get a 'range' of size, and make sure it's fine adjustable for spacing? Hoping to keep this to 15-30£

 

- From research, thought I'd get DiMarzio P types, but DiMarzio is basically out of stock (the ones I picked anyway) until after Covid (Feb I'm told). To keep it simple, I thought I'd instead just get Fender Vintage P-Bass pickups.

 

- Bearing the pickups in mind (Passive), I have no idea about pots/wires/capacitors. Ideally, I'd have just a 'kit' you assemble with the solder, but I don't know what I'm looking for. I keep seeing sets though for '4 String p Basses' that have 3 individual tone knobs. Do the pots have to be compatible with the pickups in this regard outside the [impedence?] of being 250 or 500? I was told you only need 500k for Active pickups, which I won't be using. If I get normal Vintage pickups, do I have to get a single volume and tone pot and that's my lot? Can I get a multi-band tonal knob setup?

 

- Due to how the body came out - I think I'm still within the limits - but he body is 35mm thick through the middle, and will be about 30mm deep where the control cavity will go.  THe bass will not have a pick guard (he's a finger only player, and it would cover the lovely detail in the body), so I'm going to  do the cavity from underneath. I believe that leaving 5mm thick on the top will suffice, so that gives me 25mm to play with underneath (minus a few mm for the cavity cover). Is this enough to fit all the pots and wires? What 'size' pots (knob length - hehe) would work then, short or long ones?

 

- Also, partly due to the depth of the body, I will put the jack in the edge, not the face/top of the bass.

 

Essentially, I'm hoping you experienced lot would know off the top of your heads, a simple 'package' I can assemble, not too expensive, that can actually turn this piece of wood into a bass.

 

Once it's all routed, finished etc, I will then give it over to a guitar shop to set the action, intonation, etc

 

Any help you can offer will be much appreciated.

 

Thanks

CC1

[CC1]

Second image

[mistermikev]

20 minutes ago, CC1 said:

Second image

lot of character in that wood.  I like it.

afa bridge width... not sure it matters much here because if you are using a TOM style bridge you'll have to cut the slots in it anyway... and I'm not sure you have many choices... further... if you are doing a TOM bridge you are going to need either a neck angle or a dif bridge.

I would recommend you use a clamp to place the neck on the body... and then use a straight edge to bring the edge of the neck back to the bridge area.  then draw on a potential low e and high g mark... and see how the string lines up against the neck.  You could, of course, do this all in a graphical editor. 

I don't think I could guess the ideal width of bridge based on width of nut.  it depends on the angle of the neck sides, the overhang on either side of the nut.  Further... this might need to be influenced by the pickup poles.

 

here's a good p bass diagram... can you follow this? 

if you have questions I'm happy to try and help and many more here will too... but basically - connect the dots.  the cap is just a simple .05 cap.  .047u is fine.  you just need that... some wire, a jack and two 250k pots.

 

[Bizman62]

Welcome to the addiction!

25 minutes ago, CC1 said:

exactly how deep to route the cavities etc,

It depends on your design and the gear you're going to use. For controls they're designed for a ~3 mm thick scratchplate so if you're leaving the top intact the roof of the cavity can't be much above 5 mm thick. The depth of the pickup cavities varies accordign to the pickups but there's some play to allow height adjustment. Again, if you're going to have a scratchplate the pickups are installed to the plastic, allowing for even more inaccuracy.

35 minutes ago, CC1 said:

find the method for figuring out the size bridge

So you have a neck and a nut. Measure how far from the edge the outermost strings are at the nut. Place a straightedge ruler along the neck and continue the line on the body on both sides. Draw another pair of lines inside the first two at the same distance that the nut slots are from the edge. That will tell how far apart the outermost strings should be at the bridge. The grey line marks the ruler, the red marks the outermost strings and the light grey the bridge:

[CC1]

>> here's a good p bass diagram... can you follow this? 

 

Thanks!

 

Yeah that won't be too hard. So the answer to "Can I have a Bass/Mid/Treble tone knobs config" is a no? I understand having volumes for different pickups, I don't really know how Tone knobs work. It would be nice to maybe have a second Tone know (one for Low one for high end) but if that's going to mean different/more complicated pickups and/or wiring, I might leave it...

 

>> TOM Bridge

 

Those are these (attached)? They don't look adjustable for string spacing, but I do like the look of them, so would only get them if they fit the neck I have (Replying to that below in a minute)

[CC1]

21 minutes ago, Bizman62 said:

Welcome to the addiction!

It depends on your design and the gear you're going to use. For controls they're designed for a ~3 mm thick scratchplate so if you're leaving the top intact the roof of the cavity can't be much above 5 mm thick. The depth of the pickup cavities varies accordign to the pickups but there's some play to allow height adjustment. Again, if you're going to have a scratchplate the pickups are installed to the plastic, allowing for even more inaccuracy.

So you have a neck and a nut. Measure how far from the edge the outermost strings are at the nut. Place a straightedge ruler along the neck and continue the line on the body on both sides. Draw another pair of lines inside the first two at the same distance that the nut slots are from the edge. That will tell how far apart the outermost strings should be at the bridge. The grey line marks the ruler, the red marks the outermost strings and the light grey the bridge:

 

Gracias Senor

 

E and G are 4mm (centre of the groove to the edge) from either side of 41-42mm neck at nut.

 

Doing as described, where the (saddle?) edge of the bridge would be is 70mm on the nose, so 62mm total

 

That sounds typical doesn't it? I think I've seen that sizing somewhere? (I've also seen 57mm)

 

[CC1]

I can only find 19 and 20mm spacing on Bridges. I would think it needs 20.6mm or 21mm if rounded?

Should I just be using 20mm then?

[Bizman62]

10 minutes ago, CC1 said:

70mm on the nose, so 62mm total --- That sounds typical doesn't it?

A quick look told that 19-20 mm string spacing is pretty common so if 20 is closer to your measurements then 20 it is. The most important thing is to have the strings over the fretboard, not outside of it. As you see, it's not space technology, it's pretty much about using common sense.

[CC1]

Just now, Bizman62 said:

A quick look told that 19-20 mm string spacing is pretty common so if 20 is closer to your measurements then 20 it is. The most important thing is to have the strings over the fretboard, not outside of it. As you see, it's not space technology, it's pretty much about using common sense.

Agreed - but I've been at woodworking long enough (not that long, but long enough) to know that sometimes "eh, it'll be fine" works and other times it cascades and it gets catastrophic. So especially since I really don't fancy starting again, I'm reading/measuring/checking everything in triplicate, then doing a practice on scrap, then making my cuts/holes etc. So especially if over the length of something, it ended up being way out...

 

I've also had very cheap Esquire/Pacifica type guitars that cost me £70 and the action/string spacing on them was terrible. Just trying to play high up the fret board, the high e would slip off and then get caught in the edge of the fret.

[Bizman62]

51 minutes ago, CC1 said:

I'm reading/measuring/checking everything in triplicate, then doing a practice on scrap, then making my cuts/holes etc

Very sound practice there! I'd still call that common sense rather than rocket science... Yes indeed, measure measure measure - cut.

What I meant is that the math and geometry needed is pretty simple - follow the centerline, align the strings with the fretboard, continue the neck lines on the body, make sure that the 12th fret is spot on halfways between the bridge and the nut... Even the much mystified neck break angle is simply about aligning the neck to the straight line between the nut and the bridge. Straight lines between objects with a measurable height and width.

Calculating the frets on the other hand is something I have a very vague idea about, that's like rocket science to me.

[CC1]

Yep - maybe for my 5th or 6th guitar, I'll think about doing my own neck. The neck it also seems would need a few specialty luthier tools I can't be bothered buying right now. Wife would already be miffed if she knew how much the components, the electric planer, the belt sander, R-Orbit Sander, Drill sander, Epoxy, Clamps, Hand planes, Jigsaw all cost...

 

I feel like I've done alright so far, seeing as every video on youtube is "oh, just pop on over to your workshop and pop on your £1500 bandsaw... then your pillar drill...

 

m*tha f****r I live in London, does it look like I own a workshop?!

[mistermikev]

3 hours ago, CC1 said:

>> here's a good p bass diagram... can you follow this? 

 

Thanks!

 

Yeah that won't be too hard. So the answer to "Can I have a Bass/Mid/Treble tone knobs config" is a no? I understand having volumes for different pickups, I don't really know how Tone knobs work. It would be nice to maybe have a second Tone know (one for Low one for high end) but if that's going to mean different/more complicated pickups and/or wiring, I might leave it...

 

>> TOM Bridge

 

Those are these (attached)? They don't look adjustable for string spacing, but I do like the look of them, so would only get them if they fit the neck I have (Replying to that below in a minute)

i'm sorry, in school I learned to read the first and last sentence and that is a hard habit to break!!  yes you can do bass/mid/treb but passive version (no 9v battery) would suck tone something fierce.  ie you will loose a lot of output.  could be done but not adviseable.  afa passive bass/treble... that's doable.  not going to be as drastic as active but...

this one is designed for guitar so you maybe want to put the caps in there temporarily and experiment...

perhaps this is a better diagram for your purpose

http://i605.photobucket.com/albums/tt137/pinkjimiphoton/twobuckers3waytrebbass_zpsca402e9d.png

 

the active version requires a preamp.  I'm going to assume you don't want to build yourself so then the options are: go look on alliedexpress or evilbay.

here's one if you want cheap: https://www.ebay.com/itm/2-Band-Balance-Volume-EQ-Preamp-Circuit-Bass-Guitar-For-Active-Bass-Pickup/263714709470?hash=item3d669f1fde:g:JJ4AAOSwTbVbCQb7

really this preamp has a set number of knobs (no idea what they do) I'd assume it comes w a diagram to show the input wires and it may be designed for more than one pickup (ie with a blend knob). 

 

[Andyjr1515]

3 hours ago, CC1 said:

Yeah that won't be too hard. So the answer to "Can I have a Bass/Mid/Treble tone knobs config" is a no? I understand having volumes for different pickups, I don't really know how Tone knobs work. It would be nice to maybe have a second Tone know (one for Low one for high end) but if that's going to mean different/more complicated pickups and/or wiring, I might leave it...

For a passive system, the answer is no.

If you have two pickups, then yes you can have a tone pot for each, but each of them simply bleed off more or less of the treble high-end.   To boost and cut different frequencies within a single signal (that is, the hot wire from a single pickup) would need an active circuit (basically an onboard pre-amp) so is probably out of scope for what you are trying to do.

[Andyjr1515]

Just now, Andyjr1515 said:

For a passive system, the answer is no.

If you have two pickups, then yes you can have a tone pot for each, but each of them simply bleed off more or less of the treble high-end.   To boost and cut different frequencies within a single signal (that is, the hot wire from a single pickup) would need an active circuit (basically an onboard pre-amp) so is probably out of scope for what you are trying to do.

Or do what @mistermikev was posting while I was typing 

[mistermikev]

Just now, Andyjr1515 said:

Or do what @mistermikev was posting while I was typing 

hehe, we was both headed to the sm place. 

[Andyjr1515]

Is that broadly what Hofner used to do on their violin basses with that panel of slider switches, @mistermikev ?

[mistermikev]

1 minute ago, Andyjr1515 said:

Is that broadly what Hofner used to do on their violin basses with that panel of slider switches, @mistermikev ?

I know it's some sort of passive treble/bass network... but I don't really know.

[mistermikev]

assuming this is accurate...

looks like the bridge pickup potentially hits a 10nf which would drop some highs off of it... then direct to out jack.  then both go to 3 possible dif caps and one 'off' position so depending on the values there I'm guessing it's a hi pass.  that's the long way of saying 'yeah'.

[mistermikev]

3 hours ago, CC1 said:

>> TOM Bridge

 

Those are these (attached)? They don't look adjustable for string spacing, but I do like the look of them, so would only get them if they fit the neck I have (Replying to that below in a minute)

I guess those are slotted a bit already (there are one's that barely have an indent) - that said they don't look that deep and may need to be adjusted to follow the radius.  you could easily nudge them one way or the other. 

[CC1]

5 minutes ago, Bizman62 said:

Very sound practice there! I'd still call that common sense rather than rocket science... Yes indeed, measure measure measure - cut.

What I meant is that the math and geometry needed is pretty simple - follow the centerline, align the strings with the fretboard, continue the neck lines on the body, make sure that the 12th fret is spot on halfways between the bridge and the nut... Even the much mystified neck break angle is simply about aligning the neck to the straight line between the nut and the bridge. Straight lines between objects with a measurable height and width.

Calculating the frets on the other hand is something I have a very vague idea about, that's like rocket science to me.

Kiitos

[CC1]

Alrighty then.

 

So, we have, on the way:

 

1x Fender Vintage P-Bass Pickup

 

2x 250k "long-shaft" (0.35") potentiometers

 

Hipshot 4-String Kickass Bridge (Black)

 

GOTOH gb707 machine pegs (Black)

 

Long 1/4" jack (black) - for edge mounting

 

Insulating Tape

 

.

 

Meaning all I need now, is the P-Bass pickup guard, Capacitor, Customised Truss Rod Cover, and Customised Neck Plate (decorative), and some wiring