Setch Posted July 1, 2005 Report Share Posted July 1, 2005 But I do know that if I had listened to the likes of you, I probably never would have started building 'em myself... Sorry Idch, but that is some red hot, smoking BULLSH!Ti There isn't a single experienced poster on here who wouldn't bully random strangers on the street to start building! That isn't the same thing as telling someone to dive in and possibly destroy a guitar they can't afford to trash. If you build your own guitar you control all the parameters, you can replace anything you break because *you* MADE IT, you know where everything is because *you* put it there. That ain't the case with an existing instrument. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Primal Posted July 1, 2005 Report Share Posted July 1, 2005 most likely if you do that,the neck will start to take on moisture and the original finish will start to peel away from the "finish joint" since the things you reccomend have no burn in value whatsoever ← Hmm... I hadn't considered the possibility of the original finish lifting and peeling away. One obvious solution would be to refinish the entire guitar, although that would indeed increase the finishing time, as well as the difficulty of the project. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted July 1, 2005 Report Share Posted July 1, 2005 But I do know that if I had listened to the likes of you, I probably never would have started building 'em myself... Sorry Idch, but that is some red hot, smoking BULLSH!Ti There isn't a single experienced poster on here who wouldn't bully random strangers on the street to start building! That isn't the same thing as telling someone to dive in and possibly destroy a guitar they can't afford to trash. If you build your own guitar you control all the parameters, you can replace anything you break because *you* MADE IT, you know where everything is because *you* put it there. That ain't the case with an existing instrument. ← exactly.... i had a drummer buddy who never practiced...because he was always trying to make the drum kit "better" meanwhile..he had nothing to play because he always had them torn apart for a new paint job. do not risk a guitar if it is your only ,or your best,one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmrentis Posted July 2, 2005 Report Share Posted July 2, 2005 QUOTE(Setch @ Jul 1 2005, 05:25 PM) QUOTE But I do know that if I had listened to the likes of you, I probably never would have started building 'em myself... Sorry Idch, but that is some red hot, smoking BULLSH!Ti There isn't a single experienced poster on here who wouldn't bully random strangers on the street to start building! That isn't the same thing as telling someone to dive in and possibly destroy a guitar they can't afford to trash. If you build your own guitar you control all the parameters, you can replace anything you break because *you* MADE IT, you know where everything is because *you* put it there. That ain't the case with an existing instrument. * exactly.... i had a drummer buddy who never practiced...because he was always trying to make the drum kit "better" rolleyes.gif meanwhile..he had nothing to play because he always had them torn apart for a new paint job. do not risk a guitar if it is your only ,or your best,one. I would definately listen to this! I am relatively new to building and have been doing homework and planning for a couple months now and these two guys have been a great source of information and experience for me. There are a few others that have really quality info, and at times they may sound a little harsh, but understand they are looking out for your best interest. They know this stuff inside and out and will give your a straight up honest answer. If what you are doing seems like a bad idea, they will let you know not to waste your time, money, and effort. Good luck with your project and take your time and find out exactly what you are going to do, don't get hasty and ruin the only one you have. Maybe just start a whole new one, it will take a while but you will still have something to play in the meantime. Jason Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickguard Posted July 2, 2005 Report Share Posted July 2, 2005 If you build your own guitar you control all the parameters, you can replace anything you break because *you* MADE IT, you know where everything is because *you* put it there. That ain't the case with an existing instrument. ← Good point, Setch --I guess it's all about what you can afford... On my first project (the Bocaster) I took a guitar and cut it up...but I can afford to do that, I have other guitars (which I would NEVER EVER touch, no way in HELL!), and I make a good enough living to absorb the cost of the learning process. Then again, when I was a kid, I used to be into building bicycles...so I'd scour the neighborhood searching for parts in the trash, and then I'd still take a hacksaw to my own bicycles...just to make them 'better'. So I'm just a born modder, I guess My hero in Toy Story was the kid with the monster toys JMrentis -- I kind of fell into that one for a while, when I first started doing this, I spent much more time planning, researching, hunting down parts and working on my projects than I did playing the guitar... But then I realized that there's a problem-- I can't get onstage with my weirdo guitar designs UNLESS I can pull it off by playing well...and I'm just not good enough for that yet. So I re-established my priorities, and most days I simply don't have any time to build anymore, I'm too busy PLAYING. Hmm...okay, Isock here's another thought: go to the pawn shop and pick up another Les Paul copy, this time with a bolt on neck...reshape THAT to where you want it. Or hit up ebay, there are tons of LP copies --their main weak point are their necks after all, for the rest, it's easy enough to change the hardware. If you don't have the bucks to do that, then I'll have to agree with the others, there's no point risking your guitar unless you have the bucks to absorb the loss. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmrentis Posted July 2, 2005 Report Share Posted July 2, 2005 But then I realized that there's a problem-- I can't get onstage with my weirdo guitar designs UNLESS I can pull it off by playing well...and I'm just not good enough for that yet. So I re-established my priorities, and most days I simply don't have any time to build anymore, I'm too busy PLAYING. Thats cool that you are playing more because one of the best parts of building a guitar is being able to play it when you are done. Once I have more building behind me I will work on my skills more, I'm not sure which I like better probably equal at the moment. Thats unfortunate that you don't have enough time to build, it is such a fun part of anything, just being able to create, but I guess making music is one of the most creative ways to create though. I had a lot of friends that rode bikes, they spent almost as much time working on it, as they did riding it, I'm sure after doing that you have a lot experience working with your hands and tools. One of my friends that rode bikes was insane he could grind any handrail that I could grind on my skates, which is amazing for a heavy bike. He broke the thing all the time, even with the strongest heaviest parts. He was a madman! Good luck with your music! Jason Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nollock Posted July 2, 2005 Report Share Posted July 2, 2005 Why dont you find a very cheap 2nd hand guitar and try to modify the neck on that. If it succeeds you then have 2 guitars and will be better able to do the same to your epiphone, if it fails you learnt a valuable lesson and didnt trash your good guitar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Primal Posted July 3, 2005 Report Share Posted July 3, 2005 Thats cool that you are playing more because one of the best parts of building a guitar is being able to play it when you are done. Once I have more building behind me I will work on my skills more, I'm not sure which I like better probably equal at the moment. Thats unfortunate that you don't have enough time to build, it is such a fun part of anything, just being able to create, but I guess making music is one of the most creative ways to create though. ← Thats the great thing about building guitars. You really only need a basic set of skills on the instrument to recognize a good instrument from a bad one (heck, there are even some luthiers that don't play guitar at all!). This is really one of those fields where you can excell at one aspect without being a master at the other. I am by no means a great bass player (despite what everyone tells me, haha). But I know that if I work at it I could make some killer instruments. Funding my projects, however, seems to be the hard part. This post is random and not put together well. Hopefully you all know what I'm trying to say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmrentis Posted July 3, 2005 Report Share Posted July 3, 2005 I am by no means a great bass player (despite what everyone tells me, haha). But I know that if I work at it I could make some killer instruments. Funding my projects, however, seems to be the hard part. smile.gif This post is random and not put together well. Hopefully you all know what I'm trying to say. I hear ya. The worst part of building is wanting the best everything, it's so hard to buy something other than what you like because it suits your budget better. I usually will just wait until I can save up for those expensive parts because that kind of stuff would haunt me for the rest of my life I swear! Although it will take me a lot longer than most this way, I just feel better about it. For some reason I didn't realize you were a bass player, I play guitar myself, I was meant to play bass, My friend and I had a band at a young age and at first we were a cappella. We actually got on to a local radio station at 13 or 14 years old doing a cappella. Then we decided to start using instruments, we decided my friend would play guitar and I would play bass, and we already had a friend that was decent at drums. My friend was the first to pick up an instrument an electric used at a garage sale, and I really didn't have much money at that age so finding a bass was hard for me, and my friends mom said she had seen a guitar at another garage sale and wasn't sure if it was bass or 6 string. So I got a $20 from my mom and went over to the place only to find out it was a 6 string. I was upset as I wanted nothing more than to start playing, so I decided to buy it anyways, it was barely in fair condition and she was asking like $35, it was a remake of an SG with two covered humbuckers. I was able to talk her down to $15, I think more than anything she just wanted to get rid of it. So thats how I started playing guitar, and it worked out pretty good as I was good at rhythm and my friend was born to lead, he was amazing just a couple of months after buying the thing. So we ended up getting a bassist and did some small stuff with the radio and at local schools. It was a great time. One of the things that keep me playing is that story of the beggining for my friend and I. If we were given an opportunity at that time I have no doubts we would have been small time successful, but both of us were just stoked to be able to play in front of people and we were very young making anything too big hard for us to do with school and parents. Sorry I got into that a little too much I think, oh well I can always edit most of it out if it doesn't belong here. So like most everyone said either buy another guitar to trick out or build one before you decide to shred into your current one, I have no doubts that you would end up regretting it deeply. As you won't have a guitar to play for a while and who knows if or how it will turn out as what you want to do is very tough. Good Luck! Jason Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickguard Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 we decided my friend would play guitar and I would play bass, and we already had a friend that was decent at drums. ← Ha ha, that's how I started off playing bass...my best buddy and I were purple-heads, and he was really really into Blackmore...he could air-guitar every single one of his solos so exactly you'd think he was actually playing... So we decided we'd start a band, and he'd play guitar and I'd play bass... for no other reason than that...hell, I wasn't even sure what a bass was... Well, I switched to singing a few years later, and playing guitar because it was fun to trash around on stage... Anyway, back on topic...I started sanding down the neck yesterday...took just a little bit off...I want to flatten it a little more... But I'm not sure about what to do about the fretboard--should i remove the finish? should I just leave the finish (I'm thinking of using oil for the back of the neck) Oh yeah, my buddy never actually ever got around to playing guitar! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iSock Posted July 26, 2005 Author Report Share Posted July 26, 2005 Hi guys... sorry for the late bump but I had to think, gather resources, etc. Right now, I am pretty turned off from this project by a lot of the posts here (I understand, and agree to some extent) which is why this project is (un)officially on hold, and now I am asking out of curiosity and future projects, which probably will include this one. The guys at GuitarCenter didn't feel too comfortable allowing me to measure and mess around with thier most precious guitar (douchebags...) but I did meet some very helpful people online who were owners of this guitar and game me measurements measured with digital calipers. So, anyway, that part is out of the way. My neck right now is only a couple of mm thicker in thickness, but ages thinner in width. This kind of got me worried... Is it possible to make it thinner is width? Wouldn't I have to sand through the binding and fretboard (and what about the frets....?). Help in that area would be greatly appreciated. Another big question I have is the refinishing process. How do you go about refinishing a Les Paul? Could someone explain the process to me? Is the neck color the color of natural mahogany or is it stained, etc... or if someone could point out a nice site that explains it ( I couldn't find any...) Thanks alot guys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setch Posted July 27, 2005 Report Share Posted July 27, 2005 The neck is stained, or sprayed with tinted lacquer. These shots should illustrate the difference between clear finished mahogany and coloured (in this case with red tinted lacquer): Reducing the neck width will destroy the binding, and you'll have to remove width from the frets. Then, you'll need to re-shape the head stock to flow smoothly into the neck shaft, and cut a new nut. That said, I doubt the width is *very* different - 44mm is pretty standard across the whole Gibson spectrum, maybe 1mm or so either way. For a good reference on refinishing, try: The guitar Reranch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olddog Posted July 27, 2005 Report Share Posted July 27, 2005 I have to agree with GodBless Texas. You can sand a neck down to sawdust in an afternoon with a strong arm and 40 grit. But do you REALLY want to sand down a stock Les Paul? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickguard Posted July 27, 2005 Report Share Posted July 27, 2005 My neck right now is only a couple of mm thicker in thickness, but ages thinnerthinner in width. This kind of got me worried... Is it possible to make it thinner is width? ← Is that a typo? Did you mean the existing neck is THICKER than the Les Paul? Anyway, didn't realize there was a binding on there--that introduces a whole new set of issues. You might look around for a unbound neck instead. Another issue: changing the width of the neck at the nut can lead to problems with the strings slipping off the edge --although if you re-notch (or replace) the saddles on the bridge to compensate for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erikbojerik Posted July 28, 2005 Report Share Posted July 28, 2005 I'd just make a whole guitar from scratch...slow yes, but you'll learn a ton. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CudBucket Posted July 28, 2005 Report Share Posted July 28, 2005 i think it is a very bad idea to take a rasp to your neck when you are so completely unfamiliar with guitar work...you could easily cut off too much and ruin the neck. The best advice you could be given. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CudBucket Posted July 28, 2005 Report Share Posted July 28, 2005 The guys at GuitarCenter didn't feel too comfortable allowing me to measure and mess around with thier most precious guitar I don't blame them. It's a guitar store, not a Home Depot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmrentis Posted July 28, 2005 Report Share Posted July 28, 2005 The guys at GuitarCenter didn't feel too comfortable allowing me to measure and mess around with thier most precious guitar (douchebags...) but I did meet some very helpful people online who were owners of this guitar and game me measurements measured with digital calipers. That sucks! I have three guitar shops close to me and all of them said no problem. I first went to guitar trader and they let me trace out a Rg onto some poster board. I had also called guitar center about doing that on a Jem and the dude said cool, but only when it was slow and noone was there. So when I went in they actually didn't have one,at least didn't have one out, which was amazing because they had a lot of guitars. So I ended up tracing another Rg but this one had the aanj which I got the basic curve from. And the last place was a place they sold mostly used guitars called moze guitars, I talked to the owner I believe, and he had no trouble with me tracing an RG also, again they had no Jems and I doubt they ever get used Jems in there. Anyways I decided not to do that grip anyways, I wanted as much top as possible to show off the figured wood I got. Another thing you can ask is if they will trace it themselves, I'm not sure if thats what you were wanted though. But I'm glad you got the info you needed. I would try to make a friend down at guitar center, if you do you would more likely be able to do things like that. I know most of them have no problem with you tracing and measuring the models on the floor for everyone to play. Those things are tore up anyways, from stupid kids banging them around pretending they can jam. So if you can find one that has the same shape but in a cheaper model and it's on the floor, do it that way. Well good luck with your project, I hope it all works out for you. Later. Jason Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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