Red Cedar Les Paul

[blink 182]

Hey, I just received enough red cedar to make at least two solidbody and necks, but what i want to know is what would it sound like with a denser wood as a cap on a les paul?

Am I wasting my time trying to make a les paul or should I try to make a different body design or am I completly wasting my time. By the way this wood is at least 100 years old.

[Mattia]

Hey, I just received enough red cedar to make at least two solidbody and necks, but what i want to know is what would it sound like with a denser wood as a cap on a les paul?

Am I wasting my time trying to make a les paul or should I try to make a different body design or am I completly wasting my time. By the way this wood is at least 100 years old.

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How well is the stuff quartered? Because that could be prime soundboard material for acoustics if it's on-quarter with zero to minimal runout.

As for tonality, I've never built with it, but I know people who have. It's a very, very soft wood, fragile, completely unsuitable for necks, but could work for bodies. It won't sound remotely like a mahogany Les Paul, though. Would make a light, resonant guitar, though. If you want Les Paul tone, use Les Paul woods. I wouldn't hesitate to use it as a body wood, but I'd probably want to put it in something with single coils/P90s. Just a gut instinct.

[westhemann]

i saw a gibson lp...i think it was a melody maker?it was a cheapo...it used western red cedar ...i want to say the neck was cedar.

i would check musicians friend to see,but it is offline for the moment.i will verify later.

it's definately superior to pine,anyway.

[Setch]

Wes, I expect it was made of cedro; a type of cyrus sometimes known as spanish cedar. Most woods commonly called cedar have no relation other than the distinctive smell, and most are not actually cedars at all.

[westhemann]

Wes, I expect it was made of cedro; a type of cyrus sometimes known as spanish cedar.  Most woods commonly called cedar have no relation other than the distinctive smell, and most are not actually cedars at all.

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could be...i swear it said "western red cedar"

but musicians friend has the woods used wrong quite a bit..

[Mattia]

It'll have been Cedrela Odorata, aka Cedro aka Spanish Cedar, NOT WRC. Definitely not WRC. Oh, and Cedro? Not a cyprus. Same family as the mahoganies (meliciae), looks vaguely similar, is lighter, bit weaker, and very commonly used on classical guitars for necks.

[westhemann]

i don't doubt it.musicians friend has been wrong before.

i wish the site was up so i could check it out

[Drak]

It'll have been Cedrela Odorata, aka Cedro aka Spanish Cedar, NOT WRC. Definitely not WRC. Oh, and Cedro? Not a cyprus. Same family as the mahoganies (meliciae), looks vaguely similar, is lighter, bit weaker, and very commonly used on classical guitars for necks.

I'm building a Tele out of that stuff right now, like as in, I just walked in from routing the edge of the body (quilted maple top and bottom)

Everything you said is dead on about it's characteristics.

I wonder what it will sound like? Soft, for jazz?

I can't see that guitar twangin' and clangin', know what I mean?

[blink 182]

Really Drak would that telly happen to be the 30 day one?

So you think I should give it a shot?

I mean it used to be a door so I would much rather have a les paul (or even a telly) than an old door.

And to be perfectly honest I have never heard a les paul live so I am very unwary of the sound so as long as it sounds anything like a guitar (any guitar) I would be happy, personally I own a strat (alright its a squier) and am unsure on how I like its sound but I dout the cedar would be bright being so soft. but anyway, thanks for the advice.

Also Mattia I would have enough left over for several sound boards because it is over 2 inches thick, so that would be cool also.

[Mattia]

Really Drak would that telly happen to be the 30 day one?

So you think I should give it a shot?

I mean it used to be a door so I would much rather have a les paul (or even a telly) than an old door.

And to be perfectly honest I have never heard a les paul live so I am very unwary of the sound so as long as it sounds anything like a guitar (any guitar) I would be happy, personally I own a strat (alright its a squier) and am unsure on how I like its sound but I dout the cedar would be bright being so soft. but anyway, thanks for the advice.

Also Mattia I would have enough left over for several sound boards because it is over 2 inches thick, so that would be cool also.

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If I'm reading this right, I think Drak's saying he's building a Tele out od Cedro, not WRC. If you use the WRC, it'll sound like a guitar, should be fine, but not like a les paul. I think Ellie Erikson's built a few WRC guitars, should be some info on this in the MIMF library.

[erikbojerik]

There was a guy (heath) on the USA Custom Guitars forum who built a Jazzmaster out of solid spruce (at least the body; don't know what kind of neck). As I recall, it was quite bright.

But WRC is a bit darker than spruce, at least when used for acoustic guitar soundboards.

[crafty]

I'd say, build it and tell US what YOU think. We could sit here all day and say "That's going to sound like crap" or "That's going to sound great", but no one really knows for sure.

I remember when the LP Smartwoods came out everyone was like "Don't waste your money, it's going to sound like crap". The tone isn't the same as a regular maple/mahogany LP, but who cares? If you're a '59 purist, buy an R9 or pony up for the real deal!

I think a Les Paul made of cedar sounds like a cool idea. Maybe a flat-top with a traditional acoustic bridge and a piezo in there would really sound quite nice, I think.

[frank falbo]

I would use it for sure, but I'd definitely cap it and I would hollow it out if it were me. It's such a resonant wood that I would think an experienced builder could get that guitar singing. It would have great attack. I wouldn't even use Maple for the top wood, rather something like Lacewood, Walnut, or even Hard Ash. Lacewood would be my first choice, because it would be like a hard/softwood intertwined grid over the top of this hot sounding back. If you don't do it send it to me.

[Mattia]

Question here: why hollow it? At standard size, a solid WRC body would already be 2/3 the weight of an equivalent mahogany body, maybe about the same as the lightest Swamp Ash you're ever likely to find.

I've been playing with the thought of building a WRC guitar, but I've got too many others that need building first. If I find that one special piece of wood though, who knows what'll happen...

[blink 182]

Oh year the smartwoods les pauls right how could I forget?

Yer why the hell shouldn't I do it, exactly its my guitar I should like the sound.

Frank I live in Australia so I wont be using lacewood I will be using tasmanian oak for the cap it is quite bright so with the dark WRC it should make an intersting tone.

And crafty I think I will just go with a regular TOM and humbuckers but I will still have some left over for acoustic soundboards.

oh yer I was reading a website that sould fender acoustics and this one fender had meranti sides and back, meranti is readily available here in oz so thats what I will use for the back and sides.

[blink 182]

Hey for my les paul that im gonna make i want to know if i can use sycamore for a neck is it dense enough?

according to what i found sycamore is 590 kg/m3, compared to honduras mahogany's 545kg/m3 and thats what les pauls use, so is there any unforseen problems I might face, I will have to get pics and start it im f***ing sick of all this questions about the stupidist stuff. of course none of my questions are stupid

[Mattia]

Density won't tell you anything, honestly. Stiffness and strength is more important.

When you say 'sycamore', we talking US Sycamore, or UK Sycamore (ie, a maple). Completely different woods. The Sycamore (US) that I've got in acoustic-back/sides form is rather on the floppy side, wouldn't use it for a neck if this piece is typical of sycamore. It's perfectly quartered, so that's not the reason. The UK Sycamore (maple) I've come across should do lovely for necks, though. It's a touch softer than Eastern Hard Maple, harder than Western in my limited experience.

[blink 182]

This is probably gonna not help but it is also called plane or platanus and the actual tree looks like this

[Mattia]

OK, where are you located? If you're in the US, and US folks are calling it Sycamore, it's proper Sycamore, a Plane. If it's the UK, it may be the maple, Acer Pseudoplatanus (ie, the maple-that-looks-like-a-plane tree). The wood's really quite different. They're both goldeny yellow, but the maple, well, looks like maple. And the plane looks lacewoodish. As in, heavy medullary ray flecking if you've got a quartered piece.