johnuk Posted September 27, 2003 Report Share Posted September 27, 2003 Hello! My second parcel came thru from the US today with some other parts I'd ordered in. I had bought the parts from a guy on ebay who seemed really helpful. They included, a set of chrome pickup surrounds, an original Floyd Rose in it's box and a set of in line tuners. The pickup surrounds are of questionable quality; they do not look as though they've been machined square in anyway. But they're not too bad. However! I really liked how firm and positive the action was on the Gotoh tuners I have on the Chome Chick JS10th. So I figured I'd also get some Gotoh SG38's. I found the same guy selling the bridge was also selling SG3805's. I am unsure whether or not I took it for granted these would actually be genuine Gotoh tuners. He used the words "Gotoh style six-in-line tuning keys, chrome finish, model SG3805(almost identical to the Grover tuners)". And then since he included the Gotoh label I thought they must be Gotoh tuners. I was fairly saddened by the pickup surrounds, but even more so to discover the 'Gotoh' tuners were in fact vacuum sealed in a WD Music package. What makes me sad is that I am going to be putting a huge amount of effort into this guitar (Which is my first hand built one), and I don't want that effort off-set by using horrible parts from the start, the same reason I spent a lot more buying the original Floyd Rose bridge than I could have done on a licensed bridge. It would appear that WD Music have labeled these tuners as SG3805CL's. In comparison to the genuine Gotoh tuners, they are pretty bad! The chroming is not bright, but instead a dull steely colour. Around the winding post itself I can easily see deep, visible machining marks. The casting isn't too bad, but the surface is covered in deep scratches and pits that are just not present on the Gotoh's. The action of the tuner is relatively positive, but seems to run over bumps as it goes, so the gears are likely not aligned. I am just wondering if it is unfair of me to not expect this since he used the word 'style' in his description? These tuners are nothing like Gotoh's except in their bodies are roughly the same shape, the handles aren't. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...%3AEOT%3AUS%3A3 More to the point, it states there are 6, and for some totally unknown reason there are 5 in the pack from WD Music vacuum sealed in place? I have opened the pack to check for any identifying marks, Gotoh is definitly no where to be seen on them. It says 'Made in by Jin-Ho R2' on them (That is worded correctly). Am I unfair to ask for these to be exchanged? For a start I'm one tuner short! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhoads56 Posted September 27, 2003 Report Share Posted September 27, 2003 I pay $15 AUD ($9 USD) for those JIN HO tuners for REAL CRAPPY guitars that need new tuners. That price ($9 USD) is for a set of six. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnuk Posted September 27, 2003 Author Report Share Posted September 27, 2003 You're joking......? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zandro Posted September 27, 2003 Report Share Posted September 27, 2003 Yeah, sounds to me like you really got screwed on that one. I'd definitely complain/try to get a refund. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhoads56 Posted September 27, 2003 Report Share Posted September 27, 2003 Nope, no jokes. I think you would have realised they werent the real deal from reading the text IF the GOTOH brand image wasnt present. However, if you are like me, you scan the page looking for identifying marks, eg: the GOTOH image... Stick it to him, and complain to the seller AND Ebay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnuk Posted September 27, 2003 Author Report Share Posted September 27, 2003 I had to pay 20+ pounds importation tax on all this stuff, so I'm just hoping he's going to tell me someone must have packed them wrong! Ughhh! I'm going to go mental if this keeps up! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuckguitarist Posted September 27, 2003 Report Share Posted September 27, 2003 yea, he definately should not have put the gotoh logo on that page... I would complain to ebay about this guy definately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnuk Posted September 27, 2003 Author Report Share Posted September 27, 2003 I'll see what he says! This will be interesting... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted September 27, 2003 Report Share Posted September 27, 2003 i have never bought anything off ebay...and i have never been screwed on guitar parts...i think i will keep it that way.i think the gotoh logo was a really dirty trick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuckguitarist Posted September 27, 2003 Report Share Posted September 27, 2003 i have never bought anything off ebay...and i have never been screwed on guitar parts...i think i will keep it that way.i think the gotoh logo was a really dirty trick. same here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krazyderek Posted September 27, 2003 Report Share Posted September 27, 2003 that's actually false advertising putting the gotoh logo on there when they're infact a completely different product, can't he get in alot of **** for that? I'd ask for a total refund on the price and shipping, but the taxes you have to fill out a form for your countries customs agency and you'll get the money back from them next time you do taxes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnuk Posted September 27, 2003 Author Report Share Posted September 27, 2003 I just found the other tuner, there are 6 there, it had fallen out the pack and to the bottom of the bag. But still... I've probably been waaay too polite! If he refuses to refund them (I don't want them exchanged) I'll see if ebay are willing to cover them. ------------------------------- Hi Sean, I got the parcel through this morning. The bridge and pickup surrounds are fine, but I think there may have been a mistake with the tuners. Since the Gotoh logo was in the description, I took the word style as a figure of speach. The tuners I recieved are those by Jin Ho, sold by WD Music, which a friend of mine buys for $9 a set. I am very against complaining but the quality of these tuners is in no way comparable to Gotoh's. The Jin Ho tuners already have scratches on them and have a questionable action. The parts were packed so well they would have been bullet proof! So I am wondering if these are the actual tuners I was bidding on? As the Gotoh logo was in the description I would question if it's unfair to expect them to be at least similar. Regards, John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuckguitarist Posted September 27, 2003 Report Share Posted September 27, 2003 waaay too polite! yup! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tsl602000 Posted September 27, 2003 Report Share Posted September 27, 2003 John, You've been screwed. Sorry to hear that though. I buy the Gotoh SG38's for 21.95 Euro excl. VAT. $50 sounds outragous to me and if that **** sends you cheap ****, I'd take action. I'm not sure if the tuners on universalJems.com are Gotoh;s, but they're only $35.50 Good luck and let us know what that ebay prick has to say Coen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted September 27, 2003 Report Share Posted September 27, 2003 Nope those are generics listed on UJ, I need to get off my butt and get the other name brands listed sometime. And yes even though he stated Gotoh STYLE adding the logo is not only misleading but against the Ebay Policy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setch Posted September 27, 2003 Report Share Posted September 27, 2003 I imagine that the presence of the Gotoh logo was a msitake, given that he seems to sell gotoh tuners fairly regularly, and many traders like him use templates to create their adds. That said, the text left me in NO doubt whatsoever that these were not gotoh tuners. In eBay land you have to read carefully, caveat emptor etc.... You can take the matter up with eBay, but I don't think your case is particularly strong. Apart from the logo you had no reason to believe they were Gotohs, and he never explicitly stated that they were. Your best bet is that he helps you out because it was his mistake which misled you, but I doubt he wants to swallow the expense of shipping and import duty just to foster goodwill... Finally, not wanting to rub salt in the wound, but Stew Mac sell genuine Gotoh's for $30.55 - $20 less than you payed, assuming you paid the 'buy it now' price. I can't help but think it was an ill advised transaction from the start, unless his shipping was extremely competative! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnuk Posted September 27, 2003 Author Report Share Posted September 27, 2003 What is particularly odd about this is that the genuine Gotoh tuners he sells, he does so for $10 less. He does sell a number of tuners, some of which are genuine Gotoh tuners, but he has included the Gotoh logo on a number of other auctions for Gotoh style tuners. The Gotoh style tuners are the ones that he sells for $10 extra, the kind I bought. He has been quick in replying and sent me this email.... I have asked to return the tuners and exchange them for genuine Gotoh tuners. I will be reclaiming the import duty from the post office when I send them back and I'll have to see what else happens. Thanks for your opinions on this! John ------------------------------------------------------- John, hi, how are you? you know, I checked on this tuner issue & you're right, they're different than the Gotohs, however they're NOT suppose to be! the distributer we deal with changed brands, which they're done on other items, but the thing is they don't tell the dealers, which is annoying for us, becuz we're very reputeable & honest, especially with the Ebay customers. I'm going to check the other tuners we stock to make sure they're Gotoh or not, so someone else doesn't have this problem! we always go out of our way to please a customer, so you can return them or whatever you feel is fair, it's your call! sorry about the tuner mishap! -Sean Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tsl602000 Posted September 27, 2003 Report Share Posted September 27, 2003 hmmm.... at least it's better than being screwed with a bunch of shitty tuners..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted September 28, 2003 Report Share Posted September 28, 2003 Plus he is genuinely trying to help you out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest AlexVDL Posted September 28, 2003 Report Share Posted September 28, 2003 The weird thing is, I think he should have know, otherwise he wouldn't wrote "Gotoh STYLE tuners" But then again he's so honest to admit there's a mistake... keep us informed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhoads56 Posted September 28, 2003 Report Share Posted September 28, 2003 Plus he is genuinely trying to help you out. Not neccesarrily so... I know a local retailer that has a newspaper on the counter at all times, placed in such a way that your food (its takeaway) is placed onto the newspaper when you come to pick it up. He chrges the $1.50 for the newspaper, and if anyone questions it: "Oh, sorry, i thought you wanted the newspaper because its sitting right there". I bet this guy on ebay knew EXACTLY what he was doing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnuk Posted September 28, 2003 Author Report Share Posted September 28, 2003 I'm not sure which to believe, but anyway, I recieved another reply so I'll get them back in the post this Monday hopefully. My normal opinion would be to believe him but the sentence "so someone else doesn't get cheap ones" worries me slightly. I am over 3000 miles away so there's no chance I'll be able to see him in person, but then again he has sold nearly 1000 items so it's quite likely he is an actual store I guess.... who knows! But thanks again for your help! ---------------------------------------------------------------- hi, totally unacceptable on this, sometimes a distbuter will change brands, they don't tell the dealers & this happens! best thing is to send them back to the P.O. Box address, you can even send them postage due if you want, make sure you ship them by Airmail, not economy, cuz packages shipped econony usually don't get delivered!!!! *laugh* when I get the tuners back, I'll refund you promplty, we're very busy right now, but I'll definitely make sure about the other tuners & make sure they're Gotoh, so someone else doesn't get cheap ones. if I have the same model in Gotoh in stock, I'll just ship ya the correct set! anything else, just ask! sorry for the hassle on this! usually the shipping dept. inspects everything before it's packaged, but when it's busy, they don't always do that! -Sean Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted September 28, 2003 Report Share Posted September 28, 2003 i think he probably gets away with it 90% of the time...and when he gets called on it he just fixes it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuckguitarist Posted September 28, 2003 Report Share Posted September 28, 2003 i think he probably gets away with it 90% of the time...and when he gets called on it he just fixes it thats kinda what i was thinking Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krazyderek Posted September 28, 2003 Report Share Posted September 28, 2003 i think he probably gets away with it 90% of the time...and when he gets called on it he just fixes it thats kinda what i was thinking pretty smart considering he's selling a 9$ set of tuners for 50$, he only has to sell one more set of knock off tuners to cover his losses in this instance.. Johnuk, why did you pay 50$ in the first place? Real Gotoh SG381's shouldn't retail for more then 30-35$ not trying to make fun here or anything i'm actually curious, cause it doesn't say that they're locking tuners or have any of the cool features like magnum lock, HAP, or lubri coat.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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