Beast8576 Posted December 1, 2006 Report Share Posted December 1, 2006 OK, I think there might be a topic on this but I searched it and did find the information that I wanted. The question???? Can you use standard Pine 2x8s for the body of a guitar? I am planing my first build and I'm buying the part so I can start in the spring, can any one advise me on this subject. Thanks for any and all info. Buy the way you guys are a god send on information a newbe needs!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
verhoevenc Posted December 1, 2006 Report Share Posted December 1, 2006 I can't see why not? Pine has alot of the same characteristics (to a degree) as like spruce and what not. It's soft, transfers sound pretty well, stiff, can get some nice tight grain lines if you search for the right piece. Hell, Benedetto has even been known to make an archtop or two out of construction grade pine! With that in mind, Parker makes a couple guitars, solid body, fully out of spruce, so I don't see why you can't out of pine. Just be prepared to have to put a really hard, maybe even thick finish on this bad boy cause these kinds of woods dent easily. I would however selective find the best pieces. Tap them to make sure you're getting one's the resonate well/at all Also, get as close grained and quartered as you can find, that will help. The fewer the knots I'd imagine the better too. Also, keep in mind there are several different types of pine... so keep in mind properties will change from specie to specie, even piece to piece. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickguard Posted December 1, 2006 Report Share Posted December 1, 2006 Yeah, but if he's going to spend all that time trying to find the right pine, why not just go straight to buying real 'guitar' wood? Alder doesn't cost much, neither does poplar. At least over there. Buying pine just seems like a waste of money, unless you really want to make the guitar out of pine. Beast, as long as you're gathering parts, put 'wood' on your list... Low-priced wood example (edit: I just noticed that this wood has only been air drying for a few days--so I'm guessing it's not ready to made into a guitar just yet...it's just to give an idea) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fryovanni Posted December 1, 2006 Report Share Posted December 1, 2006 Yeah, but if he's going to spend all that time trying to find the right pine, why not just go straight to buying real 'guitar' wood? Alder doesn't cost much, neither does poplar. At least over there. Buying pine just seems like a waste of money, unless you really want to make the guitar out of pine. Beast, as long as you're gathering parts, put 'wood' on your list... Low-priced wood example (edit: I just noticed that this wood has only been air drying for a few days--so I'm guessing it's not ready to made into a guitar just yet...it's just to give an idea) Holy Cow! That is some freshly cut wood. I am blown away that someone would call that guitar(instrument) wood. I guess that is a good way to get a premium price for green wood from sucker guitar builders. Kiln dried Alder is worth about $3.-$5bd. ft. Very well dried for instruments and surfaced for guitar body(assuming you don't do it yourself) will run about $35-$40 per. blank. Man Mick, what's up with the "real 'guitar' wood". I always thought you were pretty open to new ideas .You must have picked up that fresh shipment of figured Maple and are ready to build some guitars with real top woods I kid Have fun with your projects! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickguard Posted December 1, 2006 Report Share Posted December 1, 2006 Man Mick, what's up with the "real 'guitar' wood". I always thought you were pretty open to new ideas .You must have picked up that fresh shipment of figured Maple and are ready to build some guitars with real top woods I kid Have fun with your projects! Yeah, I felt bad about putting the link there after I noticed the wood wasn't dry...still, he'll get the idea. And I prefer 'alternative' woods...found wood, actually...the wood for the neck I'm getting ready to build comes from an old shelf! So beast, maybe that's a better idea...instead of going for pine, have a look around for old pieces of wood...you never know what you'll find... Oh yeah, the next guitar I make is going to have flame-quilt-burl top...sure, that has to exist somewhere...gold hardware, of course. Bling! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted December 1, 2006 Report Share Posted December 1, 2006 interesting to see this same question still being constantly asked.. use what you wish..but be prepared for an unstable instrument...pine 2 by 8s are still green whan you buy them,and they twist while they dry(like most wood,to a degree)and a 2 by 8 is 1 1/2" thick,which by the time it stabilizes enough so you can surface it,becomes to thin to use as a typical guitar body. i always said and i still believe that a serious wood worker would not use those cheap yellow pine 2 by's for anything other than wall studs or floor joists...and if you can't put the effort into sourcing proper wood,then how will you ever take the time to source the other parts well,or even build the guir to any degree of tolerances.. laziness in the first part of building a guitar translates into the rest of it as well..some people don't like to hear this at all..but "openmindedness" is not always what it seems to be...sometimes it translates straight into "just not knowing any better" which i assume is why the question was asked. bottom line...you can build a guitar out of compacted buffalo dung and laquer it into submission if you wish...but why would you ever want to put the time an effort into something that every woodworker knows is an inferior material to work with and alder can be had at most hardwood shops for about $3.50 a b.f.,and they will surface it for you and thickness it to 1 3/4" for a small charge...trust me,it's worth it...especiallyy considering yellow pine is barely less expensive,and will probably split at the endgrain while it dries. also..just so you know..the good quality white pine that IS a decent wood to work(sort of)is almmost always $3 to $5 a b.f anyway...once you do the math on the cost of the stud...but it is still too thin for most guitar hardware without a 1/4" top but i am sure you will hear others who disagree... and yes..my first guitar body was pine...it warped and wa too thin for the hardware...it routs and shapes poorly,does not glue well,and looks like trash. alder on the other hand shapes well,glues well,and sounds very nice once finished. anyway...now you know my opinion based on my experiences with it...take it or leave it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitar2005 Posted December 1, 2006 Report Share Posted December 1, 2006 Don't use 2x4s. Pine is not very hard or stable but it could work. Make sure you get get southern longleaf yellow pine as it is harder than regular pine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fryovanni Posted December 1, 2006 Report Share Posted December 1, 2006 Oh yeah, the next guitar I make is going to have flame-quilt-burl top...sure, that has to exist somewhere...gold hardware, of course. Bling! Bling Baby! Reclaimed wood is an awsome way to go. Also I have a few small mills around here that seek out trees that have to be removed(blown down, dangerous, new construction...). They mill the wood and sell it at very reasonable prices. It is a very good way to use wood that would have gone to a landfill before. Peace,Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hydrogeoman Posted December 1, 2006 Report Share Posted December 1, 2006 ..... bottom line...you can build a guitar out of compacted buffalo dung and laquer it into submission if you wish...but why would you ever want to put the time an effort into something that every woodworker knows is an inferior material to work with ... Yeah but what if you impregnated the buffalo dung with epoxy before compacting? I would probably go with a poly finish on that bad boy. A BD Custom, who wouldn't want to have one of those? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted December 1, 2006 Report Share Posted December 1, 2006 ..... bottom line...you can build a guitar out of compacted buffalo dung and laquer it into submission if you wish...but why would you ever want to put the time an effort into something that every woodworker knows is an inferior material to work with ... Yeah but what if you impregnated the buffalo dung with epoxy before compacting? I would probably go with a poly finish on that bad boy. A BD Custom, who wouldn't want to have one of those? don't even think about it...i already own the rights to that intellectual property and if you use it i will have no choice but to take you in front of judge judy... nobody wants that...trust me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
verhoevenc Posted December 1, 2006 Report Share Posted December 1, 2006 Maybe we forgot to ask the real reason WHY he wanted to use pine. Maybe it wasn't because of price? Maybe he was looking for that Parker fully made of spruce sound, and just saw pine as a close comparative, easily available softwood for his experiment. Cause god knows I am ALWAYS dreaming about building a full solid body spruce guitar... Either way, if that IS why you wanted it, go to a lumber yard, chances are they will have the better type of pine, ask for their higher grades, or better yet, check if they have an spruce, cedar, or douglas fir. I went to my HARDWOOD dealer the other day and searching through boards of african mahogany found a big blank of douglas fir and was like "what the hell!?" cuase it was the oNLY board of it he had in his WHOLE shop. And he was just like "stuff shows up sometimes... wanna buy it?" lol So yeah, if you search, you shall find. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prauny Posted December 1, 2006 Report Share Posted December 1, 2006 I found a load of African mahogany thick enough for guitar bodies and some maple for tops and necks in a skip. Keep your eyes peeled for these things, they are all around just waiting to be found. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted December 1, 2006 Report Share Posted December 1, 2006 Maybe we forgot to ask the real reason WHY he wanted to use pine. Maybe it wasn't because of price? Maybe he was looking for that Parker fully made of spruce sound, and just saw pine as a close comparative, easily available softwood for his experiment. Cause god knows I am ALWAYS dreaming about building a full solid body spruce guitar.. Chris i assume he wants to use it for the same reason as everyone else...because it is so easily available...god knows it took me forever to find a good hardwood shop. but keep in mind pine is no more similar to spruce than luan is to mahogany...they are both just inferior substitutes.... Make sure you get get southern longleaf yellow pine as it is harder than regular pine. just to correct a small but common assumption here...hardness has nothing to do with anything in suitability for a guitar...stability is what you want.. for example...basswood is extremely soft,yet makes very good bodies(i prefer alder though)and mahogany is more stable as a guitar neck than maple,yet maple is harder... it's all about tradeoffs... as far as tone..my favorite combination so far is a honduran mahogany solidbody with a set maple neck and an ebony board...seems to be the perfect mixture of warmth,sustain,and clarity...but tone is mucho subjective... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitar2005 Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 Make sure you get get southern longleaf yellow pine as it is harder than regular pine. just to correct a small but common assumption here...hardness has nothing to do with anything in suitability for a guitar...stability is what you want.. for example...basswood is extremely soft,yet makes very good bodies(i prefer alder though)and mahogany is more stable as a guitar neck than maple,yet maple is harder... it's all about tradeoffs... as far as tone..my favorite combination so far is a honduran mahogany solidbody with a set maple neck and an ebony board...seems to be the perfect mixture of warmth,sustain,and clarity...but tone is mucho subjective... My comment was more from the perspective of the bridge studs holding up in pine. 2x4 pine will not hold up for very long (At least the kind that we have here in Canada). Hardness is a factor, just as stability is. You're right, basswood is a great wood even though it is relatively soft. I've had issues with studs moving a little but I fixed that with a little CA. My 1987 Jem is Basswood and it has a lot of depth in its sound and the pickups (Dimarzio PAF) really bring out the acoustic qualities. Stability is another concern. 2x4 pine is not stable and can warp pretty bad. Not sure about southern yellow pine. Fav combo - yeah I totally agree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 My comment was more from the perspective of the bridge studs holding up in pine. 2x4 pine will not hold up for very long (At least the kind that we have here in Canada). Hardness is a factor, just as stability is. use the larger studs..but pine is harder than basswood...it really is not a factor...but go ahead Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southpa Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 (edited) Funny, I helped a buddy move a bunch of lumber (and a whole lot of heavy stuff) into his truck one day. I took a close look and noticed it was 10 foot lengths of perfectly straight actual dimensioned alder 2X4, (most 2X4 lumber measures at 3-1/2 X 1-1/2). I could have used only one to make a complete 4-pce. strat body. Would you believe the SOB would not part with even ONE board out of 36 for helping him? Edited December 2, 2006 by Southpa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
!!METAL MATT!! Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 (edited) This Is A PINE and ceder guitar built by A guy on the shredder!! http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d177/dea...tar/new1087.jpg http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d177/dea...tar/new1066.jpg this is what he had to say about it Specs: Mahogany Neck, Ebonised Fretboard, 21 frets, 20"Short scale, MOP diamond inlays Body... PINE with RED CEDAR top, in Trans Black BCR BDSM pup re-wired to 4 wire, 1 volume, Series/parallel switch, Custom Pre-amp w/ Treble, Mid and Bass. How does it sound? Surprisingly GOOD, even with the BDSM (if it can make a BDSM sound good, it must be good right?) Clean is VERY good, you almost can get a real dreadnaught sound out of it, it's ritch and bassy. Dirty it produces a very strat neck pup sound, bright, but not too bright. I learned a few things from this guitar: a) Stick with a brand of paint you trust Red Cedar is the softest s#%^&@est wood i'm never touching it again c) Pine is AWESOME, i'm going to use it again d) The stealth is my favourite guitar shape of all time, I'm going to build me another !!METAL MATT!! Edited December 2, 2006 by !!METAL MATT!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marksound Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 Funny, I helped a buddy move a bunch of lumber (and a whole lot of heavy stuff) into his truck one day. I took a close look and noticed it was 10 foot lengths of perfectly straight actual dimensioned alder 2X4, (most 2X4 lumber measures at 3-1/2 X 1-1/2). I could have used only one to make a complete 4-pce. strat body. Would you believe the SOB would not part with even ONE board out of 36 for helping him? You shoulda brained him one of 'em. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 man southpa....that guy sucks....hell i send spare wood all over the world if i'm not using it.never heard of alder 2 by 4s though.... metal matt...yes it can be done...but do look at that guitar...he should have solid finished it...the wood grain is butt ugly on that cedar top... but the cedar may have the tone in that guitar..if the top is thick enough...cedar is comsidered a good viable tonewood. and yes,tone is subjective...but you should not make the guitar out of 1 1/2" lumber without a top...like i said it ain't thick enough...something else..there is alot you casnnot tell about a guitar from a picture, the guy that wrote the post...if you really want my personal opinions about different woods and their workabuility...send me a p.m. i will be glad to share the info without cluttering the thread here with repeated information...i have worked with quite a few woods...everything from alder to bubinga to bocote...if you are serious about building and not just playing around on the net anyway Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
!!METAL MATT!! Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 metal matt...yes it can be done...but do look at that guitar...he should have solid finished it...the wood grain is butt ugly on that cedar top... but the cedar may have the tone in that guitar..if the top is thick enough...cedar is comsidered a good viable tonewood Agrred!! just showing that it has been done and with good results. !!METAL MATT!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 maybe i should make a cow dung guitar...there is plenty of it around where i live,and o promise i could make it look as good as a pine guitar... i am just being facetious bythe way...no offence meant...i do believe that pine is the worst possible wood to build a guitar body from...but if you want to,go ahead...it will be good practice for when you DO get serious Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drak Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 i do believe that pine is the worst possible wood to build a guitar body from. Be very glad you don't play Telecasters then, or hang out on Telecaster Forums like I do. In that camp, Pine is ALL THE RAGE these days, lots of guys are loving it, and pretty much all the boutique suppliers for Tele parts are offering Telecaster Pine Bodies, most are 1 1/2" thick also, as that is 'period correct'. Me? I wouldn't, I think it's a bit of a fad, but if it rocks their boat, who am I to talk trash? I do, however, like Spanish Cedar, which is pretty damn close to Pine in it's softness and resonance characteristics. The original Telecasters (Esquires actually I think) were made out of 1 1/2" Pine, but Leo changed it when he found out it wasn't very sturdy, but that hasn't stopped the Pine Revolution from becoming firmly entrenched now, it's in full swing over there, with lots of happy campers playing Pine Telecasters. So, it IS a perfectly viable tonewood, sometimes we (myself included) need to keep an open mind on such things, as I used to believe the same thing, but have since accepted Pine as a perfectly viable Tonewood. ...I wouldn't take it out of the house w/o a brick hard polyester finish tho... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
!!METAL MATT!! Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 (edited) Well Neal Moser started A thing on the shreder a while ago the whole "it's gotta be special tone wood or it won't sound good" Myth stuff Me I really dont bleave that Pine is any good for guitars At all NOT AT ALL but I do like the Idea of people trying new things and doing things that Others say cant be done or should not be done this is A quote from Neal in responce to the Pine and ceder Guitar Hey Reece, excellent job. HOWEVER, when I say PINE, I mean 2x4's with knots, right out of Home Depot and then glued together. Cut the body out of THAT. THEN, make the neck AND finger board out of PINE as well. I want this guitar to be SOOOOOO WRONG it's pathetic, SO, if it DOES sound good, it will dispel all the "it's gotta be special tone wood or it won't sound good" STUFF. If I'm wrong about this I will be the first one to report that I was WRONG. However, I have a sneaking suspicion that it's going to sound a lot like a guitar. Hmmmmmm............Matt just built his bench and has some extra PINE 2x4's left over. P.S. Chris (noeffin) bought a BCR Warlock off Ebay one time. It looked pretty nice and sounded pretty good for a "only sold over seas" import. When he went to rout the electronics cavity to add to the electronics, we realized it was made of FOAM. YUP, blown into a mold FOAM. Even the neck, which looked to be neck-thru, was foam. The only wood on the guitar was the finger board. SO, blown into a mold FOAM sounded pretty damn good. Why wouldn't PINE. !!METAL MATT!! Edited December 2, 2006 by !!METAL MATT!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drak Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 FOAM? Now you've gone TOO FAR! I'm vomiting and spewing and hurling huge chunks of vomitous bile all over the Castle! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 hehe..well according to that we are all wasting our time trying to build nice guitars...we should just buy the cheapest p.o.s. we can and sell our tools...because why build iff it makes no difference. my point is...you build to have fun and to make a better guitar than you could buy for any reasonable amount of cash...why would you try to cut all of these corners when you could buy a guitar more easily that already has the corners precut for you? i can't see a thin pine body being even heavy enough to balance properly..but i guess since most hobby guitar players play sitting down,maybe that is not so important to them... i don't think pine is going to sound good for metal anyway..but maybe that is more my problem...but my question has always been "why use pine?" and the answer is "because it is cheap and most people have it laying around the yard or in the garage" tele?c'mon drak...you know i have never soiled my hands with one of those things i don't know though...i would have to hear from someone i consider a good builder that has actually built and played one...build one drak...i will listen to your opinion of the workability and tone...i trust your judgement...but that's because i know you are a good judge of tone and feel...i just don't think i coulld put the effort into pine when it really does not rout,glue or sand as well as alder...a wood i know to be plentiful,cheap,and which makes excellent guitars for everything from country to meal.. the all purpose wood..that's what alder is... you ever finish that alder guitar drak?you never told me what you thought of it vs the poplar you used to use Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.