Daniel Sorbera Posted March 11, 2009 Report Share Posted March 11, 2009 I'm thinking of trying out some 2 part poly. Can I use any automotive clear? Or is there some made specifically for wood? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wood is good Posted March 11, 2009 Report Share Posted March 11, 2009 (edited) 2K poly is automotive. That is the only 2k out there. The 2 part varnishes are different. Automotive 2k are the higest of quality, car painters will not mess around with non quality products. Some even use it as a sealer too, because it dries so fast. Edited March 11, 2009 by wood is good Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
syxxstring Posted March 11, 2009 Report Share Posted March 11, 2009 I've used Kustom Shops, Alsa's and HOK's. 2k Poly is still poly... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToddW Posted March 12, 2009 Report Share Posted March 12, 2009 what would be the advantage over say Sherwin Williams CAB acrylic or a catalyzed lacquer? Are the 2K's more durable than a catalzyed lacquer? (My flexner book is on loan) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wood is good Posted March 12, 2009 Report Share Posted March 12, 2009 I would say 2ks are the most durable of all, almost polyester like! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southpa Posted March 12, 2009 Report Share Posted March 12, 2009 I'd go with Imron. Its on my truck and a few guitars and when (if ) I get a boat it will be on that too! Good reading here: http://www.bronkalla.com/upkeep/spray_imron.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToddW Posted March 12, 2009 Report Share Posted March 12, 2009 Syxxstring, The HOK stuff looks pretty amazing, and Coast sells "small" quantities. So can I ask you. I have a mini HVLP coming, 1mm tip which is about the same as a 1.3 on a full size gun. That seems like it'd work with UC35. To get a quart of Uc35 is about $30, catalyst 1/2 pint is $21, a pint of reducer is around $11 (figure I need some to clean the gun and to reduce the mix, right?) So for $70 I'll have enough catalyst and reducer to mix 1/2 the UC35 in a 2:1:1 ration. pint:cup:cup. giving me a quart of finish, and leaving a half quart of UC35 for me to store, or I could buy more reducer and catalyst . . . . If I buy just that, will that "quart" or 2k concoction be enough to spray 1 or 2 guitars, obviously I wouldn't mix it all at once since I assume I'll need to do 3 or 4 coats minimum over the SG100 they recommend for candy coating. Since I'm a beginner, I figure there will be a lot of wasted material, but I'm just trying to get a handle on how much of this stuff you need. I've only used rattle can's before this. Thanks, Todd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
syxxstring Posted March 12, 2009 Report Share Posted March 12, 2009 Syxxstring, The HOK stuff looks pretty amazing, and Coast sells "small" quantities. So can I ask you. I have a mini HVLP coming, 1mm tip which is about the same as a 1.3 on a full size gun. That seems like it'd work with UC35. To get a quart of Uc35 is about $30, catalyst 1/2 pint is $21, a pint of reducer is around $11 (figure I need some to clean the gun and to reduce the mix, right?) So for $70 I'll have enough catalyst and reducer to mix 1/2 the UC35 in a 2:1:1 ration. pint:cup:cup. giving me a quart of finish, and leaving a half quart of UC35 for me to store, or I could buy more reducer and catalyst . . . . If I buy just that, will that "quart" or 2k concoction be enough to spray 1 or 2 guitars, obviously I wouldn't mix it all at once since I assume I'll need to do 3 or 4 coats minimum over the SG100 they recommend for candy coating. Since I'm a beginner, I figure there will be a lot of wasted material, but I'm just trying to get a handle on how much of this stuff you need. I've only used rattle can's before this. Thanks, Todd Todd, First off read the HOK tech manual, come back read it again. Clear is a 4:1:1 ratio. 4 parts clear, 1 part reducer, 1 part catalyst. Buy your catalyst and reducer in the pint containers if you wont use it all quickly they store better unopened. I use about 3 ounces mixed per clear session, giving me about 3 flowing coats for a body. My recomendation would be 2 sessions of clear, level sand then flow coat. Buff and polish as neccesary, but a lot less this way. For a kandy, I would consider the Kandy base coats, very close in effect much easier to spray. Are you looking to show wood grain? If so I would clear it, level sand, rescuff with a red scotch brite then kandy it. If your looking for a solid color, you should use their primer and sealer. Yes you can mix brands and yes paint jobs can blow up, seriously HOK is formulated for custom jobs and a much great mil thickness than production paint. Skimping on the primer is like saying build my house with a styrofoam foundation the foundation doesn't matter. Their primer requires a sealer to paint over, also catalyzed, the good news is the sealer is tintable and the metallic sealer is great. For a kandy job I would go over the metalic sealer, either silver or tinted with 5% pagan gold depending on the top color. For cleaning the gun I use gun cleaner, you find it at Home Depot labeled Lacquer Thinner. Reducer will work but is way more expensive. The great thing about Coast is if you call them and ask questions they know what they're talking about, more so than I do. John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToddW Posted March 12, 2009 Report Share Posted March 12, 2009 Hi John, 2:1:1 was from the UC35 page in their manual. Pg. 30. Wonder if something has changed. I am going to stain my daughter's guitar top a light candy red with transtint, sand it back (quilted maple) , stain it yellow, and then I was going to go clear, do a kandy red burst with an airbrush, then clear coat over everything. The back is Mahogany, so I was planning to pore fill it with epoxy, sand to the wood, seal with dewaxed shellac and scuff it to 400 grit or so before I spray it. "best laid plans of mice and men" . . . lots of places to mess this up! The HOK manual says 2-3 medium wet coats, and I assumed that was per session. Then let it cure at least 24 hours, scuff it, and do the next session of clear coating ? I have no idea how long it'll take between the 2-3 coats but will talk to Coast about which RU and KU to buy and the timing/string test part. I just wanted to see how much I'd need, because the stuff is pricey, but it sounds like I could mix 3 ounces, spray 2 guitars, and then rinse the gun and mix another 3 ounces, then shoot a second coat on both, and so on. So that Quart of UC35 should be enough to do 1 or 2 electrics. 3 rattle can's of pre-cat cost me $25, so the cost isn't really that bad since I'll have the tools. You said if I wanted the wood to show, that you'd clear, then spray the candy, then clear again. Would you use UC35 for that first clear coat, or the SG100? (Edit: I called Coast, they had me call HOK. Thought the SG100 would cause the dye to bleed. Neither coast nor HOK had any experience putting SG100 or UC35 over shellac, but the tech guy at HOK said he'd go UC35, wait 2 days, flat it with 800grit, then do the burst with SG100. UC35 an hour later. Great people at Coast and HOK. Easy to reach and helpful even for a guy like me spraying a couple of small projects a year) Thanks, Todd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
syxxstring Posted March 13, 2009 Report Share Posted March 13, 2009 I was going off memory. So I was wrong if thats the manual. The other clear I've been trying and not liking is 4:1:1. Sounds like they steered your right. I have the guy who used to write HOK tech manuals on speed dial, he's painting bodies for me hopefully as I type. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maiden69 Posted March 13, 2009 Report Share Posted March 13, 2009 I have used DuPont and PPG with no problem. I find that HOK and ALSA are very good but pricey. Right now I'm using PPG for my "other" hobby (car audio) and I'm doing 2-3 wet coats, cutting down with 1500-2000 and polishing giving me a very good results. I think that for guitar work, just get what your budget (or the customers) allows. It will be VERY hard to tell the difference from one brand to the next as long as your spraying is up to speed. I'm using 2 CHEAP guns (one Harbor Freight, and another from Lowes) and a guy (who has a SATA) asked me what gun was I using because of the finish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kammo1 Posted March 14, 2009 Report Share Posted March 14, 2009 I too am looking at the 2K poly but have to admit there is so many to choose from, from experience Maiden69 which are the best clears in the 2K range that you have used that are eaasy to use ? hope you can help CHEERS! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
syxxstring Posted March 15, 2009 Report Share Posted March 15, 2009 Here's the deal. Pick a system and go with it. Get and read the manual, go with it. The makers of paint know way more than the jobber who will tell you to save $5 on a cheaper primer. ( You wouldn't use cheaper concrete on a house foundation and hope its okay for a nominal sum would you?) If you use PPG stay all PPG, primer, sealer, base, clear. The same with any system. Refinish products for body shops are meant to work quickly and emulate factory paint, look at the cars you see. Is the orange peel etc. you see up to your standards. Then you can save a few bucks with a refinish system. If your doing a lot of graphics, use a custom paint. I like HOK for support, history and product availability. I can't get ppg in 2 oz containers for graphics. HOK's uc35 is designed for up to 35 mil's of paint last I checked, refinish clears will be good for 6 or 7. My favorites are HOK and Autoair. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihocky2 Posted March 17, 2009 Report Share Posted March 17, 2009 Quick question on the AutoAir. Since it is a waterbased paint, and meant to be used on cars. What do you lay down for a base coat to stop the wood from soaking a ton of it in? Do you spray a base of your clear coat or do you use the primer that goes with you system? I want to try some of the AutoAir stuff soon since I can get it locally and cheaply for simple graphics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maiden69 Posted March 17, 2009 Report Share Posted March 17, 2009 Quick question on the AutoAir. Since it is a waterbased paint, and meant to be used on cars. What do you lay down for a base coat to stop the wood from soaking a ton of it in? Do you spray a base of your clear coat or do you use the primer that goes with you system? I want to try some of the AutoAir stuff soon since I can get it locally and cheaply for simple graphics. Lot of people use an intercoat after the base before doing any graphics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
syxxstring Posted March 17, 2009 Report Share Posted March 17, 2009 I've done it a bunch of ways. Direct to the wood, over sanding sealer, over primer or over clear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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