dpm99 Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 I'm working on a solid Bubinga neck. Twice now I've tried sanding it to a finished state, and twice it's gotten rough again by the next day. Last night I was very careful to go through all the grits, from 100 all the way through 12,000 (with micro mesh). It was as smooth as glass. Then this morning, not so much. I'm guessing this is the grain raising in places I have runout. Has this ever happened to anyone else? And...what would you do? I was hoping to have an unfinished neck, but now I'm thinking a little TruOil or something. I don't know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitar2005 Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 Let its settle for longer before polishing it. What are you using got finish and how long are you waiting before smoothing it out? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpm99 Posted January 24, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 No finish. I'm talking about raw wood. Warmoth does Bubinga necks without finishes, and I thought I might try it. It seems oily enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prostheta Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 Burnish the wood. You can do this dry with oily woods however there is nothing wrong with adding a little non-drying oil and burnishing the wood with 0000/00000 steel wool. I'm thinking of getting a few polissoirs made up, which are short packs of tightly bound straw or reeds (think shaving brush but solid) which you can use to burnish up oily woods raw or to add a wax finish. Denim is great for burnishing, and I used this on a was finish for a bed I constructed recently. The reason I thought of a polissoir is that they burnish the wood by compressing the surface in addition to pushing a finish. I can't say I have ever had a problem with an oily wood that usually takes a good polish "furring up". This information is based on how I guess I would tackle it. The issue sounds a little weird to me, however your grain runout idea is quite plausible in theory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotYou Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 (edited) I usually rub oily woods down with 0000 steel wool really well after sanding. On anything like cocobolo, ebony, etc., it'll get a nice, smooth shine out of it, which you can't seem to get from sanding, even with high grits. You have to keep in mind you're just sanding wood and not a finish, so it's not going to act the same way. Most of those woods "finish" themselves with their own oils and waxes and will stay looking nice if you rub them down with the steel wool like that. I've never tried it on bubinga, but it's worth a shot, for sure. I've never tried Prosthetas approach, but that sounds interesting. Edited January 24, 2013 by NotYou Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prostheta Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 It's nothing different to using steel wool really, although it definitely doesn't leave bits of iron torn up by rough endgrain in the wood. Steel wool was a turn of the 20th century invention so polissoirs are just old-school stuff. I kind of like it though because the provenance of arts is important to me. A strip of denim chased over the neck with two hands is a good readily-available substitute. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pan_kara Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 Hah, I'm just about a week or two away from having to finish a bubinga neck. Since its just the outside two out of 5 laminated strips I'll be trying to put a finish on it, but still this thread came just in time I'll report here if I learn something interesting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitar2005 Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 At a minimum, I would apply a sealer coat of shellac or tung oil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 Bubinga is not an oily wood.I don't know why everyone keeps calling it one.It is a dry wood..no oil..no wax.I have two bubinga guitars on my wall right now.If yours is oily it was added to it or it still has too much moisture in it It needs a finish.It is very stable but you should at least oil it or it will always feel rough.Personally I used Catalytic Varnish and Wipe on Poly with good results.It has a surface texture like mahogany but with larger pores A few coats of tru oil rubbed in would be very nice 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prostheta Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 Probably why, yeah. The Maple/Bubinga neck I made with a central Bubinga stripe burnished up well enough on its own, however that is likely more down to the density of the wood rather than oil. I ended up adding oil because of the Maple anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 Yes it does burnish up nice,but like you say it's because of the density most likely...the surface of the woods burns just a little and gets shiny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prostheta Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 *cough* Burnishing is the fibres compressing, you're thinking of burninating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 Okay... I am not even a little embarrassed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prostheta Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 David will be pissed when he gets back online and sees what we've done to his thread. You deal with it Wes. I had nothing to do with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 Instigator! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob123 Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 On a serious note, could it be possible that the wood was not dry all the way? So the "moisture" escaping causes the grain to raise? Would doing a pass with a damp cloth then sanding alleviate this issue? I know that works for maple, but I haven't used large pore woods yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpm99 Posted January 24, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 Ha! I'll consider burninating too. I think I'm gonna try a few things in order. First I'll go with the denim. If that doesn't work, I'll try steel wool. After that, I'll pull out the TruOil. Wes, I understand what you're saying about it not being oily. It's not - not in the same way as rosewood or ebony, but I think it's significantly more oily than maple, for example. Bob, it's dry. Last time I checked it was at 9%. Actually, that damp cloth idea isn't bad. Raise the grain and then sand. I might try that too. As it is, it's not really so bad. It just has a few spots that aren't as smooth as I'd like. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prostheta Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 I'm going to see if a local brushmaker can run me up some polissoirs. I'd like to see how they could perhaps fit into luthiery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pauliemc Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 Bubinga needs a finish. it is realy hard & stable but it is not an oily wood. I rub in a single coat of danish oil. Then a few days later i chase it with a folded up belt of un-dyed egyptian cotton lightly wetted with external danish oil. then I use an old leather belt (smooth side to the timber) & buff it up using long strokes & a lot of pressure. Try not to build up too much heat when lapping/chasing it with the leather. Wait a few days then polish it up with some crumpled up news paper. Smooth as glass, shines like glass & plays fast as fook 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitar2005 Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 Wes, I understand what you're saying about it not being oily. It's not - not in the same way as rosewood or ebony, but I think it's significantly more oily than maple, for example. I never thought of Ebony as oily. Rosewood, yes, Cocobolo, yes but Ebony? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prostheta Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 Simple test. Either boil it and see if much oil is secreted from the wood or wipe it with Acetone. Thinking about it, I used to wipe all my necks clean with Acetone (unless bound) and I must have done so with the Maple/Bubinga neck. It never cross-contaminated so on that basis I wouldn't call Bubinga oily. It can certainly have pitch pockets though. Ebony definitely does not cross-contaminate....Cocobolo is bad though.... @pauliemc - sounds to me like a polissoir would be perfect for the job if that works for you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotYou Posted January 24, 2013 Report Share Posted January 24, 2013 Hmmm I wasn't sure if it was oily or not, so I just went with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpm99 Posted January 25, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 I think I hit on a controversial topic, which wasn't my intention, and from the looks of things, a light finish is probably the answer to my problem. But just to stir the pot a little more, I don't think Rickenbacker ever finished their Bubinga fretboards, did they? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prostheta Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 Rickenbacker clearcoat their fingerboards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpm99 Posted January 25, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 Rickenbacker clearcoat their fingerboards. Then I stand corrected. Light oil finish it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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