Copper plating on to of chrome hardware?

[beckers]

Ok so I'm contemplating a build with copper accents, has anyone Copper plated on top of Chrome hardware? I'm aware of the electroplating process, but am most concerned about the machine heads, wondering if the plating will jam the gears? Any suggestions?

Paul

[Prostheta]

Not heard of it. Copper is part of the chrome plating process though so you might want to contact the manufacturers to ask if they will stop at the copper stage. Hipshot might be open to this suggestion as they have done this before.

[Ripthorn]

An alternative to electroplating or buying new hardware would be to buy some copper leaf. Small booklets are cheap, but you would have to lacquer over it so it didn't wear off.

[curtisa]

I have a friend who steampunked his motorcycle, which included copperplating the exhausts and parts of the frame. He did exactly what Prostheta suggested and asked the electroplating firm who did the work to only go as far as the copper plating stage of the chroming process. Can't remember if the pre-chromed metal had to be stripped back to bare to start with though?

[pan_kara]

there is the "vintage copper" finish that schaller offers on their parts, not sure what they do exaclty..

(but I do love the look)

[Prostheta]

Just to qualify my previous statement about copper being an intermediate part of the chrome plating process.

Normally the substrate - for example an aluminium or zinc alloy - is electroplated with copper as the first step. Because copper is soft, it can be burnished to remove inconsistencies in the workpiece ("mush" or "smush" buffing) like a filler of sorts. Nickel is then electroplated on top of that layer to provide a strong resistant base for the chrome.

Your concerns about copper jamming the gears is a valid, however unless the copper is structural as opposed to decorative plating it will just wear off over time and smush itself into the non-bearing areas of the gearing along with the lubricant.

As pan_kara mentions, Schaller do a vintage copper finish which extends to some of the open-geared tuners like the BM Lights bass tuners. Whether the plating ends up in the gearing or not is unknown, however I can't see it being a major detriment to the tuner whether it does or not.

I guess a concern would be corrosion. Copper verdigris will happily seize up smaller threads like fine tuners, set screws, etc. I doubt that tuner gearings are of a size where corrosion could be an issue though.

[LightninMike]

I guess a concern would be corrosion. Copper verdigris will happily seize up smaller threads like fine tuners, set screws, etc. I doubt that tuner gearings are of a size where corrosion could be an issue though.

I had a copper plated oil tank on my Harley Softail for about 7 years, stored outside in South Florida about 2 miles from the beach. It barely got any color in that time, and the first 7 miles in from the ocean have salt laden air. Now, if you have extra corrosive sweat, it may happen quicker. The gears will be lubricated so they shouldn't seize up at all.

as stated the chroming process starts with the base metal being copper plated, then nickel then chromium. The process is usually done en masse. The worst answer you can get is " NO" so it won't hurt to ask

[westhemann]

Not copper,but you could use brass instead.Brass is much more durable than copper and darkens somewhat over time.I have even seen it darken to look almost identical to copper,yet it doesn't turn green when you sweat on it.

Not to mention brass is a more popular material or guitar hardware...

http://www.guitarfetish.com/SOLID-BRASS-STRAIGHT-Locking-Stop-Tailpeice-Hand-Polished_p_4225.html

http://www.amazon.com/Golden-Gate-S-104A-Electric-Machine/dp/B007VOLOOO/ref=sr_1_18?ie=UTF8&qid=1385168635&sr=8-18&keywords=brass+guitar+tuning+keys

http://www.amazon.com/Fender-Stratocaster-Brass-Nut/dp/B003B07LI0/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1385168731&sr=8-1&keywords=brass+guitar+nut

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0002U8E5Q/ref=s9_simh_gw_p267_d0_i6?pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=center-3&pf_rd_r=07A2M9564QPPJJWJBTG9&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=1630072202&pf_rd_i=507846

Edited November 23, 2013 by westhemann

[Prostheta]

Brass still develops verdigris also because of the copper content. Not sure whether this applies to all alloys of brass but I've done work on several vintage brass bridges which have corroded and seized up intonation screws, etc. You can always put a layer of lacquer or shellac onto brass/copper to give it a degree of protection from oxidisation.

I actually came back to this thread specifically to relate an experiment I did at school so many years ago. I'm unsure as to how this is done in industrial settings but what I figured out certainly worked in a DIY context anyway. So here goes:

Electroplating purely using DC produces weak "spongy" plating which is not durable. I wish I could remember why this is so but this is over twenty years ago....I am sure it has something to do with the electrodeposited metal gravitating more towards corners and edges as opposed to surfaces because of how electrons flow....the same for how the metal flows off the source. I was lead through a lot of this by tutors at the time so gaps in my theories were shored up by them.

I reasoned that since an AC waveform reverses the anode and cathode each cycle, you could "pull the edges and corners" back off, leaving the deposited metal on surfaces thereby building up better plating overall. By biasing the AC waveform in favour of a larger or longer positive-going phase it would favour deposition (anode to cathode) with a shorter or weaker un-plating (wow I'm technical) phase.

Although inefficient, I just made a simple circuit with a set of silicon rectifier diodes (1N4001s have a reverse voltage of 50v). Several in series one way with one in parallel to these, reversed. The voltage drop of one diode (0,7v - 0,9v) provides the larger positive-going phase whereas the cumulative drop from the series diodes reduces the magnitude of the negative-going phase. This was driven by a bench-top PSU so had current-limited protection. I wouldn't recommend making this from a mains transformer unless you have more than adequate knowledge of the safety requirements.

At the very least, this worked wonderfully for reinforcing copper tracks on the homebrewed PCBs I was making at the time. The process was much slower than "normal" DC electroplating but destructive testing a PCB as "schoolwork" showed that I could pour craploads more current across the experimentally-plated board than the DC-plated one.

This really makes me wish I had all my old schoolwork. I'd love to see how my head worked, nostalgically.

[beckers]

Wow! Some interesting responses here, I already have the tuners I want to use, and will try on a couple of odd chrome tuners, from the parts box, to see how it goes. My hope is to copper plate most of the hardware. Short Tele bridge, tuners, neck plate, screws etc. and probably a LaCab style Copper scratchplate. I think it will be an interesting exercise.....I actually like it when the copper becomes tarnished, some good effects can be had by heating too.

Paul

[Prostheta]

Testing is always a good option. It might be worth seeing how scuffing the chrome helps the process. I myself might try breaking down the chrome a little using PCB etchant like ferric chloride or - if you are especially fun - this:

http://www.instructables.com/id/Stop-using-Ferric-Chloride-etchant!--A-better-etc/

I am not entirely sure how well copper will take to shiny chrome. Since you like the tarnished look, I guess scuffing or etching up the substrate can't be too bad. Obviously, be careful of stripping back any finish on the gears or leaving stray etchant around screws, etc. after flushing.

Very interesting stuff, Paul! Keep us updated.