Chambering: Sound Vs Weight

[brutas]

I am interested in building a Les Paul style guitar. After doing a little research I have learned (or heard) that the Standard models are chambered to get them to weigh about 8.5 pounds. However, they say the Supreme is chambered to get a better sound, not just to eliminate the weight. Can someone explain how this works? Thanks for your help.

Edited July 25, 2006 by brutas

[verhoevenc]

There are TONS of threads already about this exact subject. I know cause I've said alot in them. Search function rocks

Chris

[Supernova9]

I'll try and explain the difference in pictures.

Chambered for weight:

Though not that many holes, but you get the idea. Gibson used to just drill a few holes to get rid of some material.

Chambered for sound:

Maybe even with those top 2 chambers combined.

That's the basics outlined, if you need more, verhoevenc is right, search for 'hollow body' or 'semi-hollow' or 'chambers'

[Mickguard]

There are TONS of threads already about this exact subject. I know cause I've said alot in them. Search function rocks

Chris

Well, no, I think he's asking something a little different, that is, HOW does a chambering guitar (in the Supreme style) affect the sound --why would a guitar sound better with a big hollow chamber inside?

It's an interesting question and I can't remember it being addressed recently.

[Prostheta]

Heh - reminds me in an obscure way about a discussion I had with an aircraft engineer about inflating performance car tyres with inert gases. I say up with Kryton inflated Les Pauls!

Sorry, I had the urge for a second.

*ahem*

[mikhailgtrski]

I just finished one of these and it "seems to me" that the chambering gives it a little more resonance, pretty much as advertised. Exactly how much effect it has on the tone I can't say without a similar solidbody to compare it with, but it does sound very, very good.

Mike

[Prostheta]

For my wife's birthday I've slated a LP build but I'm chambering it and adding a LR Baggs or Graphtec TOM bridge. My wife usually plays a Washburn EA20SDL so I'd like to create a sister :-)

[Ben]

I just finished one of these and it "seems to me" that the chambering gives it a little more resonance, pretty much as advertised. Exactly how much effect it has on the tone I can't say without a similar solidbody to compare it with, but it does sound very, very good. smile.gif

Sound is hard to describe with words, but 'more resonant' is also how I would best describe the difference in tone between my solid and chambered guitars.

Noticably louder acoustically too

[Mike Sulzer]

There are TONS of threads already about this exact subject. I know cause I've said alot in them. Search function rocks

Chris

Well, no, I think he's asking something a little different, that is, HOW does a chambering guitar (in the Supreme style) affect the sound --why would a guitar sound better with a big hollow chamber inside?

It's an interesting question and I can't remember it being addressed recently.

With larger chambers the part of the top over these chambers can vibrate more. This vibration takes energy from the strings and also returns it, thus affecting how the strings vibrate. For an extreme effect, put a magnetic pickup on an acoustic guitar. It sounds quite different from a solid body electric even though you are still only picking up the sound of the strings, not the top or body resonances directly.

[brutas]

So, if I understand this correctly, the more wood you remove the more it resonates and the "better" sound you get. What I am looking at doing is putting a top and back of quilted maple on this guitar. With that in mind, would I have problems if I routed all the way through the center mahogany piece (except where needed to house electronics and the sides) and glue a top an back on? I have tired to search but my browser wont let me, so I appologize if this has been covered. Thanks for your input.

[Jaam]

If you're looking for that resonating tone, yes. If you're looking for the solidbody tone, no.

[Supernova9]

When will people realise there is no 'better' tone?!?!?!?!?!?

People will tell you set necks have better tone than bolt ons. Obviously therefore Strats and Teles are worse than Les Pauls by default. Tell that to SRV, Clapton, or just about any decent player that's used Strats or Teles.

They'll tell you nitro is better than poly as it is thinner. Blind test them. I doubt they could tell.

Some people will tell you that semi-hollow guitars are better than solidbody guitars. The only way you're going to find out is to play both types and make your own judgement. Anyone that says any different is either lying or misguided.

I know that's only semi on-topic, so to answer your question, yes you can use rout straight through the mahogany centre section and glue top and back on.

In terms of guitar building, there are very few right or wrong answers, it's all about what you want, what you prefer, and how you like to do things. It's like wood selection. A guitar made out of solid maple will sound very different to a guitar made out of solid mahogany. Better or worse is down to opinion. Experiment, it's all a form of expression.

[Mickguard]

With that in mind, would I have problems if I routed all the way through the center mahogany piece (except where needed to house electronics and the sides) and glue a top an back on?

Sure, that's what I've been playing with too. It's also the basis for most Danelectro guitars, Reverend Guitars, probably others out there.

I wouldn't expect much in terms of acoustic/unplugged tone though --it's possible it'll sound kind of crappy, more like a banjo than a guitar. Depends on how much of a center piece you leave too. But you're building an electric guitar, so the unplugged tone shouldn't be a huge issue .

I like hollowbodies because I like really lightweight guitars. Just bought an Epiphone Sorrento, it's all hollow, very lightweight...the guitar sounds pretty fine unplugged, and awesome through the amp. I don't notice much problem with sustain, but then I'm using a pretty heavily distorted sound, so that's not an issue anyway.

But like Supernova says, 'tone' is subjective...and part of building guitars, for me at any rate, is being able to experiment with weirdness (but then it's not a big deal for me when a project fails, I just move on).

[unclej]

i'm going to add my two cents worth but first i have to say that i'm far from an expert. this is my first and only chambered or semi-hollow bodied build. and i built this entire guitar around the 1980 gibson t-bucker in the neck position. i wanted a blues/jazz sound and felt like the chambered body would help accomplish that. the body is walnut..not a wood known for it's mellow sound. the top is zebra wood. this piece was somewhat poreous. i left a solid stip 3.5" wide down the middle for the bridge and neck pocket then routed half way through (depth wise) between the pickups and below the bridge. i had an idea that a little air movement from one side to the other would help achieve the sound that i was looking for.

the bridge pickup is an overwound di marzio of questionable parentage and somehow this guitar came out sounding just exactly like i wanted it to..very low and mid range...bluesey/jazzy.

my point in all of this is that the end product..tone/volume/sustain, etc...is a result of many factors. pickups and how they're wired, body style, body wood density, neck wood and how it's attatched i suppose, nut material, type of bridge and probably some things that i'm forgetting.

i got lucky..well luck and a fair idea of what it should sound like. go ahead and make your guitar with the fun of making it in mind. drop some les paulish pups into it and i'll bet it will sound real close. and if not who knows? you may come up with a sound all your own.

good luck on your project

[Pr3Va1L]

I'd like to add that, as someone explained, the more hollow your guitar is, the more vibrations it dampens, and the more in dampens vibrations the less highs it'll have...

again, It's pretty easy to offset that simply with different pickups... with very bright sounding pickups, it might sound just like any Les Paul... So it's not the only thing that can change sound...

Also remember that the more wood you remove the more feedback you're likely to have after...

Anyways, good luck!