Carvetop Heaven

[Cameroo]

That maple is one of the nicest lookin pieces of wood I've ever seen. And here I thought Canada had the best maple...

Nice carve on the top too. I'd sure like to see some build pics, like doing that inlay on the headstock, and your technique for doing the carve. Did you do that by hand?

Cam

[GGW]

This one, in essence was a learning tool.

You're teasing us, right?

Very nice job.

[AprilEthereal777]

Yep echo all comments....this is an outstanding guitar....the first build factor just makes us mere mortals seem....well..mortal! I am lucky enough to have seen this guitar in the flesh and it looks every bit as good as the pics and probably better.......and the sound? Absolutely AWESOME cleans and monster distortion

Go on mate go for GOTM it's one of the best guitars I have seen...period....and no I'm not pumping up your tyres

Oh yeah and when you're finished 'learning' from it.....you can flick it my way ...I've then just gotta learn to play like Hendrix

Cheers,

Jon

[oz tradie]

Thanks for the feedback so far from everyone. Any feedback is welcome , positive or otherwise. It all helps in learning.

I was really lucky to grab hold of that particular piece of Qld maple for the body, and in hindsight, maybe a fraction foolish to embark on a first build using such a figured piece. Whewww!!!

Here are a few build pics to do with the carve and how it was achieved.

Everything I've done with this build was garnered from the resources of this website, so if you don't think there's enough information available here, then think again and use your search button .

The carve was firstly attempted using an ibex curved plane for a matter of , maybe 5 minutes.

Then I grabbed a few flap discs and a 100mm grinder and went nuts.

After that, I went the scrapers (a real favourite for the finer work) and then hand and block sanding.

The grinder is an extremely versatile way at shaping while maintaining good control.

routing a 9mm carve line to follow

apparatus

carve in progress

close to done

This is pretty much the finished carve shape although I'd modified the carve around the cutaways to allow better access to the 24th fret later on.

And lastly to Jon (Aprilethereal666), thanks for your feedback on Friday jam nights and the many email pics to and fro during the build.

cheers, Stu

[moshe_dol]

cool guitar

[Daniel Sorbera]

It really looks good. I like that you used a single piece of figured wood with no binding. It really looks unique, I can't remember ever seeing one guitar that looked like this one. The only thing I would have changed is to make the neck out of flame maple that matches the body in color and use an ebony fingerboard and tuner buttons. Than it would have been perfect.

Excellent job for a first guitar (or 5th, or 10th )

[oz tradie]

Thanks Godin.

I agree with you in regards to timber colour selection. The colours of the sheoak fingerboard doesn't contrast enough against the blackwood neck, that's a given. Although it makes it that little bit more unique.

I thought of using ebony for the whole fingerboard instead of just for the binding, but I couldn't help myself when I saw the sheoak piece. And plus it's an aussie wood which helps stick to the theme of using natives.

sheoak

more sheoak

cheers, Stu

[Phil Mailloux]

That guitar is hot!

Thanks for putting up the link for ALS, I've been looking for an aussie supplier of black veneer for ages. I think I'll have to look into a native build at some point too, that's really nice

[!WOOD!!]

Quite seriously one of the nicest guitars I have ever seen.A first build.Go figure.I think I have another 10 to go before going toe to toe with your craftsmanship.Unbelievable!!!

[thirdstone]

Hi Mate fantastic work and thanks for enlightning me to the method of carving the top,I might try that next time. From your exeriance in the building industry is there an alternative to using nitro or other such finishes. I have been trying to avoid the spray booth as it adds too much work for the hobbiest guitar builder.

To be quite honest I don't realy like the wet look , I much prefer the oiled look but I have yet to find a good replacement for lacquor.

Kev

[oz tradie]

Good to hear from ya Kev.

I've got 17 yrs experience in the automotive refinishing/repairing industry and also a few in the building industry.

That is the 'housing' building industry as I'm a carpenter by trade and a panel beater also.

But not a 'Guitar' builder.

My main experience is with automotive 2pack and now one guitar using pre-cat nitro (which is a breeze to use).

I didn't use a spray booth for the nitro, just had the double garage door open while spraying it inside.

But I did use a quality respirator and all the gear I used to wear when spraying 2 pack in the spray booth back when.

I think there are alot more people and posts on this site that can give you the right advice there.

Unfortunately one guitar build does not make me an expert. Just a more curious one.

I'd love to help but I'd be leading you astray on this one.

Have you done an extensive search under the inlays and finishing section ?

cheers, Stu

Hi Mate fantastic work and thanks for enlightning me to the method of carving the top,I might try that next time. From your exeriance in the building industry is there an alternative to using nitro or other such finishes. I have been trying to avoid the spray booth as it adds too much work for the hobbiest guitar builder.

To be quite honest I don't realy like the wet look , I much prefer the oiled look but I have yet to find a good replacement for lacquor.

Kev

[oz tradie]

edited double post

[tim_ado]

Good to hear from ya Kev.

I've got 17 yrs experience in the automotive refinishing/repairing industry and also a few in the building industry.

That is the 'housing' building industry as I'm a carpenter by trade and a panel beater also.

nice

my uncle up here in sydney sprays bentlys so im hopeing his going to do a sick job spraying my bass soon

[thirdstone]

hay Stu I thought you must have had experience in spraying. Just a point when finishing with lacquer, alot of people pile it on so thick that it looks like a plastic coating. This is easy to do and lessens the chance of a sand through. The real challange is to spray a really thin coat, sure it dosn't protect the guitar as well in the long run but it lets the guitar resonate better. Check out the recent change of heart by fender with their Eric Johnson strat also PRS has developed a new "thin coat" procedure.

By the way what is precat nitro? The last Nitro I used was durobond 851 Guitar Lacquer .

Other lacquer I have used is the stuff sold in the car shops ,Auto Pro i think its called.

Kev

[oz tradie]

hay Stu I thought you must have had experience in spraying. Just a point when finishing with lacquer, alot of people pile it on so thick that it looks like a plastic coating. This is easy to do and lessens the chance of a sand through. The real challange is to spray a really thin coat, sure it dosn't protect the guitar as well in the long run but it lets the guitar resonate better. Check out the recent change of heart by fender with their Eric Johnson strat also PRS has developed a new "thin coat" procedure.

By the way what is precat nitro? The last Nitro I used was durobond 851 Guitar Lacquer .

Other lacquer I have used is the stuff sold in the car shops ,Auto Pro i think its called.

Kev

i've also heard that the thinner the top coat , the better tonally.....................

I didn't use a grainfiller or sanding sealer with this guitar. I bought them both and tried the sanding sealer, but found it slightly diminished the figuring . I sprayed two light coats on and then took them off a day later and started afresh. I also did a test swatch with one half with sanding sealer and the other pure nitro. Pure nitro won.

I used a 1.4 tip on my gravity fed setup and thinned the coats down 50/50 to begin with. 6 coats very thin.

A very light rub all over with p400 grit. 4 days drying

From here on in I sprayed with a nitro to thinners ratio of 70/30.

6 thin coats 4 days air dry. Block back with p400 grit dry

6 thin coats 4 days air dry. Block back as above

6 thin coats two weeks for sinkback then block flat as above

The final 6 coats two weeks drying before buffing

I wasn't in a hurry to get it finished. I just wanted it right.

In the end, after the final block back before the last topcoating, there was only a very thin film of coverage with all pores and grain filled in.

The last 6 thinned coats is where I got all of my coverage from. Enough to rub back with p2500 wet and buff with the old

trusty DeWalt automotive buffer and just have enough of a shell. I feel there is just enough nitro on to not be too thick and cause problems.

In hindsight I should have used maybe a bigger tip like a 2.0 to get the build up quicker, but old habits die hard I guess.

cheers, Stu

[Daniel Sorbera]

hay Stu I thought you must have had experience in spraying. Just a point when finishing with lacquer, alot of people pile it on so thick that it looks like a plastic coating. This is easy to do and lessens the chance of a sand through. The real challange is to spray a really thin coat, sure it dosn't protect the guitar as well in the long run but it lets the guitar resonate better. Check out the recent change of heart by fender with their Eric Johnson strat also PRS has developed a new "thin coat" procedure.

By the way what is precat nitro? The last Nitro I used was durobond 851 Guitar Lacquer .

Other lacquer I have used is the stuff sold in the car shops ,Auto Pro i think its called.

Kev

I'd be suspicious in believing that a thinner finish on an electric guitar makes it sound better. The pickups sense string vibration, not wood vibration, and I have a hard time believing that a thinner finish would effect resonence on a 2" thick solid piece of wood enough that it would make the string vibrate more or less. There is no proof that a thinner finish sounds better, so far it's only marketing, conjecture, and tone voodoo; probably stemming from the fact that many low end guitars have very thick poly finishes on them because it's easy to apply.

[oz tradie]

For me, the biggest concern when dealing with paint thickness with nitro was

to have enough coverage for a protective barrier and a decent refinish and one that is not

too thick and overly prone to crazing or checking.

Hopefully I've achieved that.

The nitro used

cheers, Stu

[rhoads56]

I'd be suspicious in believing that a thinner finish on an electric guitar makes it sound better. The pickups sense string vibration, not wood vibration, and I have a hard time believing that a thinner finish would effect resonence on a 2" thick solid piece of wood enough that it would make the string vibrate more or less. There is no proof that a thinner finish sounds better, so far it's only marketing, conjecture, and tone voodoo; probably stemming from the fact that many low end guitars have very thick poly finishes on them because it's easy to apply.

Take it to the extreme, and make that poly finish four inches thick. How does the timber, which resonates at a specific frequency (depending on species, density, moisture content, grain structure, etc), combat the thickness of the finish? How is a strings vibration effected by the resonating frequency of the parts and timber it is fixed to? Maybe you should do a test, and it doesnt need to be on a full sized guitar, just a scrap of timber. You'll have to work out how to achieve the test, im not going to give you everything. Ive proven it to myself, and others, that a thinner (or even TYPE of) finish is without a doubt, better. Do some reading on frequencies, harmonic vibrations, sympathetic vibrations, and their effect of objects and structures. There is a lot more to building guitars, than fancy timbers.

Oz, nice guitar. I see many simularities to my first guitar.

[Ben]

I'd be suspicious in believing that a thinner finish on an electric guitar makes it sound better. The pickups sense string vibration, not wood vibration, and I have a hard time believing that a thinner finish would effect resonence on a 2" thick solid piece of wood enough that it would make the string vibrate more or less. There is no proof that a thinner finish sounds better, so far it's only marketing, conjecture, and tone voodoo; probably stemming from the fact that many low end guitars have very thick poly finishes on them because it's easy to apply.

Take it to the extreme, and make that poly finish four inches thick. How does the timber, which resonates at a specific frequency (depending on species, density, moisture content, grain structure, etc), combat the thickness of the finish? How is a strings vibration effected by the resonating frequency of the parts and timber it is fixed to? Maybe you should do a test, and it doesnt need to be on a full sized guitar, just a scrap of timber. You'll have to work out how to achieve the test, im not going to give you everything. Ive proven it to myself, and others, that a thinner (or even TYPE of) finish is without a doubt, better. Do some reading on frequencies, harmonic vibrations, sympathetic vibrations, and their effect of objects and structures. There is a lot more to building guitars, than fancy timbers.

Oz, nice guitar. I see many simularities to my first guitar.

of course at 4 inches it would have an effect, but surely a thin film has a negligable effect?

Obviously I havent done tests like you have, nor am I interested enough to do them, but my common sense would suggest that of all the things on a guitar that can effect the sound, the effect of a fraction of a mm of lacquer will be negligable...

[Geo]

I'd be suspicious in believing that a thinner finish on an electric guitar makes it sound better. The pickups sense string vibration, not wood vibration, and I have a hard time believing that a thinner finish would effect resonence on a 2" thick solid piece of wood enough that it would make the string vibrate more or less.

Of course the pickups only "sense" the strings. But it seems to me that the wood must "dump" something back into the strings. So, for every wave which passes along a string and bounces off the bridge (or nut), the hardware and wood determine how much of that wave is absorbed and how much is reflected back into the string. Obviously, different frequencies will be absorbed and reflected in different ratios, depending on the properties of the guitar as a whole.

Just some thoughts... and not really on topic.

But this "native aussie timbers" guitar is my favorite guitar EVER!

Edited March 16, 2007 by Geo

[Daniel Sorbera]

I'd be suspicious in believing that a thinner finish on an electric guitar makes it sound better. The pickups sense string vibration, not wood vibration, and I have a hard time believing that a thinner finish would effect resonence on a 2" thick solid piece of wood enough that it would make the string vibrate more or less. There is no proof that a thinner finish sounds better, so far it's only marketing, conjecture, and tone voodoo; probably stemming from the fact that many low end guitars have very thick poly finishes on them because it's easy to apply.

Take it to the extreme, and make that poly finish four inches thick. How does the timber, which resonates at a specific frequency (depending on species, density, moisture content, grain structure, etc), combat the thickness of the finish? How is a strings vibration effected by the resonating frequency of the parts and timber it is fixed to? Maybe you should do a test, and it doesnt need to be on a full sized guitar, just a scrap of timber. You'll have to work out how to achieve the test, im not going to give you everything. Ive proven it to myself, and others, that a thinner (or even TYPE of) finish is without a doubt, better. Do some reading on frequencies, harmonic vibrations, sympathetic vibrations, and their effect of objects and structures. There is a lot more to building guitars, than fancy timbers.

Oz, nice guitar. I see many simularities to my first guitar.

I'll definitely have to set up some kind of jig so I can conduct some more scientific tests because I've refinished a guitar three times in different finishes (auto 2k poly, nitro, waterbased laquer) and I personally could not tell any difference at whatsoever.

[tim_ado]

The pickups sense string vibration, not wood vibration,

i dont know

i just put some crappy squire pickups on a crappy NYLON string guitar and i was going to test to see if it would work

i held the pickups infront of the string and nothing

then i put the pickups on the wood itself and it worked

sounds like crap but it worked

[GregP]

tim, you probably have unpotted pickups. If the coils themselves are creating a sound from their own vibrations, they're microphonic... very undesirable. No matter which side of the "finish thickness" debate you're on, what your test demonstrates is that the pickups are no good. You can't pick up nylon strings with a magnetic pickup, of course... and the physical vibrations of the string's wave isn't sufficient to rattle the coils in your pickups.

[rhoads56]

I'll definitely have to set up some kind of jig so I can conduct some more scientific tests because I've refinished a guitar three times in different finishes (auto 2k poly, nitro, waterbased laquer) and I personally could not tell any difference at whatsoever.

how many weeks/months in between each finish, and was the guitar and amp set up EXACTLY the same each time. Yeah, right.

[oz tradie]

This was my first cut out inlay. I couldn't decide what to do , so I stuck with an 'S' with a garoooovy font I like.

Inlay is pretty addictive. (p.s. my fingers are fairly short but , honestly not that short !!)

cheers, Stu