Blackdog Posted December 10, 2007 Report Share Posted December 10, 2007 (edited) My second Project has officially started. No big innovations here (yet), I’m still sticking with proven designs of guitars I actually want to own. These are the specs: Solidbody, carved top doublecut in the shape of the PRS Santana (or LPDC). The back is 31mm honduras mahogany and the top is 19mm flamed maple. Long neck: 24 frets joining the body at the 23th. One piece Indian RW, with CF reinforcement and a Hot Rod. The 13° tilted-back headstock is an adjusted version of the one I used on my 1st build, now with a maple bound rosewood headplate. The fingerboard is maple bound rosewood, 25"scale with 12” radius. I will use the Wilkinson/Fishman tremolo bridge on this one. Two humbuckers, mag volume, piezo volume, mag tone and 3-way toggle. So this is what I can show at the moment: And some progress pictures: A template Body w/wiring channel Top jointed Top rough cut Glueing top to body Neck blank w/TR and CF Bound FB Bending maple for headplate Glueing the maple to headplate Neck tapered Lot's of rosewood and a hint of maple Edited December 12, 2007 by Blackdog Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oblaty Posted December 10, 2007 Report Share Posted December 10, 2007 Wow! That is a nice looking project.. Looking forward to see some progress. Good luck with it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inisheer Posted December 10, 2007 Report Share Posted December 10, 2007 Looks great so far. What kind of finish are you planning, and are you doing any inlays again? Your neck looks great so far, I love the look of everything being the same except for the binding. And let us know how you like using all that indian rosewood....the only time I've worked with EIR (a fingerboard) it made me sick....it smells AWFUL! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PTU 7's. Posted December 10, 2007 Report Share Posted December 10, 2007 Very nice project, blackdog. The neck it's very nice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geo Posted December 10, 2007 Report Share Posted December 10, 2007 (edited) the only time I've worked with EIR (a fingerboard) it made me sick....it smells AWFUL! Aw, I like the smell! Poor you. Dude, that neck is beautiful. I want to try a rosewood neck some time. Now couldn't you leave the neck "unfinished" except for fingerboard oil? Or is that a bad idea? I think the unfinished neck might feel really cool. Edited December 10, 2007 by Geo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackdog Posted December 11, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 11, 2007 Looks great so far. What kind of finish are you planning, and are you doing any inlays again? Your neck looks great so far, I love the look of everything being the same except for the binding. And let us know how you like using all that indian rosewood....the only time I've worked with EIR (a fingerboard) it made me sick....it smells AWFUL! I was thinking about making it blue, but you beat me to that... Seriously, I'd love to make a blue PRS one of these days. But for this one I'm thinking some kind of amber or some deep cherry for the top, I might try some kind of double staining. It will have faux binding and the back will be left natural. The original idea was to have just a glossy top, and the back oil finished, but the honduras mahogany is quite softer than the sipo I used before, so it will need the protection of a thicker finish. So the whole body will be finished glossy, something I will have to work out when the time comes... the only time I've worked with EIR (a fingerboard) it made me sick....it smells AWFUL! Aw, I like the smell! Poor you. Dude, that neck is beautiful. I want to try a rosewood neck some time. Now couldn't you leave the neck "unfinished" except for fingerboard oil? Or is that a bad idea? I think the unfinished neck might feel really cool. The neck on the other hand will be left pretty much bare. I think I'll use some Danish Oil for wood protection, very sparingly on the FB and a little more on the neck back and headstock. This should darken the wood and keep a good feel of polished bare wood. I think this is what PRS does on their IRW necks. Brazilian RW is supposed to smell to roses, the only thing I'm sure is that IRW does not. But I don't really mind the smell too much, which is fortunate because I'll be breathing RW for a while... Regarding the inlays, I wanted to use this very cool design, but I think I've seen it used somewhere else. So the current baseline is to go for slightly more elaborate designs but to keep the feathers theme to maintain a "visual connexion" with my previous build. Will we put an inlay on the top ?? Possibly. It looked nice on the first one and is something not seen very often. Thanks for the comments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
For-The-Love-Of-Music Posted December 11, 2007 Report Share Posted December 11, 2007 Regarding the inlays, I wanted to use this very cool design, but I think I've seen it used somewhere else. So the current baseline is to go for slightly more elaborate designs but to keep the feathers theme to maintain a "visual connexion" with my previous build. Will we put an inlay on the top ?? PRS use Bird Inlay themselves. Is that where you saw them Frankly, I really like the bird inlays, but Idon't know about everyone else... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackdog Posted December 11, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 11, 2007 Regarding the inlays, I wanted to use this very cool design, but I think I've seen it used somewhere else. So the current baseline is to go for slightly more elaborate designs but to keep the feathers theme to maintain a "visual connexion" with my previous build. Will we put an inlay on the top ?? PRS use Bird Inlay themselves. Is that where you saw them Frankly, I really like the bird inlays, but Idon't know about everyone else... It was meant as a joke,just forgot the I really like the birds !!! But they belong in a PRS. Unfortunately the 2 PRS I own are bird-less, that's why I made this TRC for one of them: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mlennon Posted December 11, 2007 Report Share Posted December 11, 2007 currently working on a similar project including the fishman piezo trem, 2 SD humbuckers, mag vol, piezo vol / blend, tone, mini toggle(mag/mix/piezo) & 5 way rotary selector. Would be interesting to post soundbites once complete to compare. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inisheer Posted December 12, 2007 Report Share Posted December 12, 2007 Sorry to beat you to making a blue guitar, although you'll probably finish this long before I finish my project No matter what color you decide to use, I'm sure it will look great. Since you like those bird inlays but want something a little more elaborate, perhaps you could try their the newer version, "modern eagles" I think they call them...or you could come up with your own design, which would make the guitar even more personal. Could you tell me more about the piezo system you are using? I would love to be able to make a more acoustic tone, but I have never been able a piezo bridge that didn't cost well over $100. And by the way, that truss rod cover looks great! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmrentis Posted December 12, 2007 Report Share Posted December 12, 2007 Inlays from DePaule Supply For some good ideas for inlays and for good product, check out Andy's stuff. He has a bunch of great inlays. I have so many future inlays already picked out and almost all aren't predesigned sets, though most of the pre-designed sets are wicked. Anyhow, just in case you haven't seen that site, its well worth a look. Andy is a great guy and takes good care of his customers, I highly recommend and suggest his products, just as someone did to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hector Posted December 12, 2007 Report Share Posted December 12, 2007 (edited) nice one blackdog, I wish I had access to a rosewood neck like that. keep up the good work Edited December 12, 2007 by Hector Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IPA or death Posted December 12, 2007 Report Share Posted December 12, 2007 Inlays from DePaule Supply For some good ideas for inlays and for good product, check out Andy's stuff. He has a bunch of great inlays. I have so many future inlays already picked out and almost all aren't predesigned sets, though most of the pre-designed sets are wicked. Anyhow, just in case you haven't seen that site, its well worth a look. Andy is a great guy and takes good care of his customers, I highly recommend and suggest his products, just as someone did to me. I agree about Andy DePaule. He's got some great stuff, a HUGE inventory, and is a super friendly and helpful guy. I got him to do an original design of my name because I have never done any inlay at all (and frankly don't think I could with very good results) and it turned out great. He keeps your design on file in case you want another one someday. Blackdog, it looks like a great guitar. Congrats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superfly Posted December 12, 2007 Report Share Posted December 12, 2007 Nice work blackdog ! Maybe the Dutch PRS Clone Builders Association can be founded. Some other dutch guys are into prs building. More info at www.gitaarnet.nl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DougK Posted December 13, 2007 Report Share Posted December 13, 2007 Can't wait to see how this one turns out! -subscribed- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackdog Posted December 13, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 13, 2007 Sorry to beat you to making a blue guitar, although you'll probably finish this long before I finish my project No matter what color you decide to use, I'm sure it will look great. Since you like those bird inlays but want something a little more elaborate, perhaps you could try their the newer version, "modern eagles" I think they call them...or you could come up with your own design, which would make the guitar even more personal. Could you tell me more about the piezo system you are using? I would love to be able to make a more acoustic tone, but I have never been able a piezo bridge that didn't cost well over $100. And by the way, that truss rod cover looks great! Well, I wouldn't count on finishing it before yours. But it's not a race anyway. Now Killemall has started a "PRS-ish" doublecut, and he'll surely beat us all !!! The kid works fast !! The design for the inlays will definitely not be the birds. Great design, but already taken unfortunately. We were planning on progressing the feathers concept for this one at least, but I have to admit that DePaule designs are awesome (thanks jmrentis, for that link) !! I have a more jazzy oriented build planned for the future and some of his vine designs are now in my wish list. I have had the wilkinson/Fishman bridge for ages now. I had it installed in a parts-strat for a short time, then the guitar got sold with a normal Wilkinson tremolo (at the time it was not Gotoh). I think I paid for this one something like $250 to $300 at the time. It's been gathering dust in a drawer since then, it's time to do something useful with it. Even though I'm not a tremolo player myself, the piezo will be cool. nice one blackdog, I wish I had access to a rosewood neck like that. keep up the good work Hey !! You should be using "brazilian" rosewood !!! Sorry, that's an easy joke I couldn't resist. I'm originally from Argentina (now in The Netherlands) and even though I only got into this hobby 4 months ago, I know it's not the case. Traditional guitar building timbers are not easy or cheap to come by there, but at least there are domestic alternatives. Nice work blackdog ! Maybe the Dutch PRS Clone Builders Association can be founded. Some other dutch guys are into prs building. More info at www.gitaarnet.nl Hmmmm, not a bad idea. Maybe Mattia wants to join, he was bashing Gibson in another thread, he must be a PRS guy then !!! But I might stop the PRS cloning after this one, I'm going to start a LP-ish singlecut for my son soon, and I might build me one too. I like LPs very much, but I have a few ideas on changes I would like to try on a LP platform. Progress Report: well, there hasn't been much progress... I just bent and glued the two missing pieces of binding to the headplate, but couldn't even get to sand them flush yet... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RjY Posted December 13, 2007 Report Share Posted December 13, 2007 Hey, looks good..... If its going to be blue i'll pass you the same link i passed INISHEER Blue PRS finish Good luck!!! RjY Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackdog Posted December 13, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 13, 2007 Hey, looks good..... If its going to be blue i'll pass you the same link i passed INISHEER Blue PRS finish Good luck!!! RjY Thanks for the link !! I think it's pretty much what I will end up doing, that tutorial is still quite useful for any color. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RjY Posted December 13, 2007 Report Share Posted December 13, 2007 Yeah, its a good finishing guide in general, just lots of you seem to be building Blue PRS's at the moment so it seemed relevant........... RjY Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackdog Posted December 16, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 16, 2007 Progress Report !!! I finally put a few hours into this build: I finished the binding on the headplate, shaped the headstock and depth-tapered the back of the neck. I also trimmed the heel a little bit and run a 1/2"round-over bit along the back edges to remove some of the excess wood. The headplate and fretboard are not yet glued on, but putting things together for the picture it looks like this: Another... Back of headstock... Heel... After the wood removal I've seen that flatness of the front face needs a little adjustment before glueing the fretboard on. Nothing dramatic, some sanding should solve it nicely. Then after the fretboard and faceplate have been glued in place, I'll start the actual neck carving. This time I went for a slimmer profile than the previous build (it feels quite substantial). This one will be along the lines of the PRS Wide/Fat. We have decided to stay with the feathers theme for the FB inlays, but I think we will go for a full set (not only 12th fret) this time. We'll see once we have the pearl pieces cut... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hector Posted December 17, 2007 Report Share Posted December 17, 2007 Hey !! You should be using "brazilian" rosewood !!! Sorry, that's an easy joke I couldn't resist. I'm originally from Argentina (now in The Netherlands) and even though I only got into this hobby 4 months ago, I know it's not the case. Traditional guitar building timbers are not easy or cheap to come by there, but at least there are domestic alternatives. hey blackdog, brazilian rosewood is getting hard to get too, there has been some people going to jail here. so no more brazilian for me, or anyone else. not even mr. reed smith himself. lol. (anyone noticed that the 513 has a mahogany neck now?) time to experiment with some other local alternatives. I`m hearing good things about granadillo as a substitute for brazilian in acoustic guitars. keep up the good work, dog! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackdog Posted December 26, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 26, 2007 hey blackdog, brazilian rosewood is getting hard to get too, there has been some people going to jail here. so no more brazilian for me, or anyone else. not even mr. reed smith himself. lol. (anyone noticed that the 513 has a mahogany neck now?) time to experiment with some other local alternatives. I`m hearing good things about granadillo as a substitute for brazilian in acoustic guitars. After this discussion I thought it would be nice to make a whole BRW neck. So I went last friday to visit a timber supplier some 150km from where I live. I remembered from my last visit that he had "some" pieces of BRW. But what he's got there is all small recycled pieces. Maybe you can make a fingerboard or two, but nothing like a neck out of what he has. And terribly pricey too. I bought a piece good for a fingerboard in Santos Palisander (Pau Ferro), but couldn't find a piece good enough for a neck.... I guess I'll stick to IRW for the time being, I have another piece for a neck just like the one I'm making now... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackdog Posted December 26, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 26, 2007 OK, I guess it's time for an update. Hope you've all had a great Christmas, I had time to work a little on my project during what it is here a week long holiday. The body: I routed the springs cavity for the tremolo. Unfortunately I run into the wiring channel. Not a big issue, really. As I can always close it with some veneer, aluminum tape, or even leave it open. I also routed the bulk of the control cavity, all the way through the mahogany body, up to the maple top. Will need deepening, but only after I have the top carved. The back. Another view. The neck: A lot more work went into the neck. Now the headplate and fretboard have been glued on, and the back of the neck has been rough-shaped. Still more wood to remove though. But had many problems along the way. So far I seem to have worked them all out with reasonable success... Here I test fitted the tuners and TRC to have an idea of what is going to look like. Another Another Another The multi-binding you see here is the result of a problem solving exercise: When I tapered the depth of the neck with the router I made a mistake that left me with 1mm less than what I wanted to have. I had to make up thickness, so I decided to do this maple/macassar veneer trick under the fingerboard. For cosmetic consistency it had to be done on the headplate too, and this is the result. I actually like how it looks, so I'll probably plan it from the beginning next time. The double side dots at the 5th fret are another mistake correction. To guide the drill bit consistently I made an aluminum piece that allows me to drill single and double holes. At the 5th fret I aligned it using the wrong mark. I decided it looked better doubled than off-centered... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackdog Posted February 7, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2008 Ok, let me revive this old thread with some updates... Significant progress has been made. I finished the neck's heel, and shortened it accordingly. I also cut the neck pocket in the body. This time a nicely tight fit. Some things I'm actually doing better than on the first build. Also routed the pickups' cavities. These didn't go completely well, I need to make me a new, more accurate, template. They're still perfectly functional, but not as clean as I wanted. The recesses for the back cavities covers were also cut, these went well and are really clean. I made the covers too, just like on my 1st build, from ply-wood I made from mahogany+maple+mahogany 1.5mm veneer sheets and with the maple section cross-grained. The result is a very stiff and nice looking material that after sanding has about 4.2mm. Carved the belly-carve too. This time significantly deeper and wider than on my first build. After the edge roundover and belly carve the back is pretty much finished and it looks like this: With covers removed. I have also advanced the top quite a bit. For this build I decided I wanted an angled top and the recurve on the edge, I feel they look better. So after cutting the lip around the edge (I don't know how to call it...) I run a round-nose bit too, to produce the recurve and get rid of the sharp angle. Now I was ready for the top angle, for which I made this jig. So now the top angles from just in front of the bridge mounting posts down to the edge where the body meets the neck, at a gentle 2.3°. From there to the tip of the horns the angle becomes 0° again (to leave enough carving material at the horn tips). The neck pocket is now at 0° with respect to this new top plane. After routing the pickup cavities I started with the rough carving of the top with the mighty power-grinder and the sandpaper slap disk. The sandpaper roller on the handheld drill also proved quite efficient for this rough "sculpting". It was also very useful for carving the lower cutaway scoop and the belly-carve. This is where I stand now. All in all I think it's going well, a few things here and there that will need a little cosmetic correction, but nothing really serious so far: When routing the neck pocket, the bit made a small (about a mm) notch on the top edge of the pocket. I will need to refill it with some maple-dust epoxi mix. I needed to reshape a little bit the lower cutaway after the neck pocket had been routed. The bit produced a little tear-off (or is it tear-out ??) at the front edge of the pocket. Again, some cosmetic filling will be required. Both can be seen here. Next steps: obviously to continue with the top carving and then the control knobs dishes. In the meantime I'm waiting for my wife to finish with the fretboard inlays, she's been getting a little sidetracked lately and I will need that finished before fretting. Thanks for reading. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitar2005 Posted February 7, 2008 Report Share Posted February 7, 2008 The multi-binding you see here is the result of a problem solving exercise: When I tapered the depth of the neck with the router I made a mistake that left me with 1mm less than what I wanted to have. I had to make up thickness, so I decided to do this maple/macassar veneer trick under the fingerboard. For cosmetic consistency it had to be done on the headplate too, and this is the result. I actually like how it looks, so I'll probably plan it from the beginning next time. The double side dots at the 5th fret are another mistake correction. To guide the drill bit consistently I made an aluminum piece that allows me to drill single and double holes. At the 5th fret I aligned it using the wrong mark. I decided it looked better doubled than off-centered... Very, very nice work. I'm jealous. Love the double binding. It adds a lot to the guitar. This is definitely something I want to try on my next build, probably an LP Custom type. I reminds me of the John Page telecaster headstock. http://www.johnpageguitars.com/ if you click on the price list tab, you'll see what I mean. That binding around the headstock must have been quite challenging to get on there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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