Truck Bed Spray-on Liner As Guitar Finish

[tone seeker]

Hey all...new to the site. Love it here. Anyone use or have you heard of anyone who used black spray-on truck bed liner as a guitar finish? I'm building a tele with and alder 2pc body and thought it might be an interesting mod. The main concern is (of course) how it would effect the tone/flavor of the guitar. Though it may sound obscure, I think that it could look pretty sweet if done right. Any input would be appreciated-Thanx-Dano

[Lord-of-the-strings]

Hey all...new to the site. Love it here. Anyone use or have you heard of anyone who used black spray-on truck bed liner as a guitar finish? I'm building a tele with and alder 2pc body and thought it might be an interesting mod. The main concern is (of course) how it would effect the tone/flavor of the guitar. Though it may sound obscure, I think that it could look pretty sweet if done right. Any input would be appreciated-Thanx-Dano

I'd be more concerned about masking everything off... that stuff sprays pretty thick (right?) and if you don't mask your neck pocket, etc, off then your in for a world of hurtin' once that stuff dries

And Ibanez use at least 1/8'' (Over exaggeration) of paint and laquer and they seem to sound all right

[Desopolis]

bedliner can be brushed on..

and I guess it would work, it wouldnt be very smooth.. and if you sanded it I dont think youd get the result your looking for.

[Rashin]

I've sprayed bedliner many times into my Jeep... Is there a reason you think this would be a good idea?

I can see it making your skin pretty raw...

[Logical Frank]

I think that rough texture would look kinda cool. I dunno if I'd like how it feels though.

[Racer X]

There goes the guitar tone, right out the window.

[pmarlin]

There goes the guitar tone, right out the window.

I would think your sound would be pretty dead, maybe even kill your sustain.

[thegarehanman]

How can anyone say that'll kill "tone?" What is tone? What's good tone? What can you add or subtract to make tone "good?" Those are hard questions to answer and almost impossible to quantify. I think it might be a painfull guitar to use, depending on what type of bed liner you use, but I think it would look cool and I doubt It'd have a negative effect on your guitar's sound if just sprayed on the body.

peace,

russ

[tone seeker]

Thanks all for the interest and input. The reason that I was even considering using truck bed liner spray as a finish is that I built a pair of custom designed MTM transmission line tower speakers for my living room and the speaker face and trim are a teak veneer and with the matte-black bed liner, they look incredible together. The spray cans are available at any auto store(cheap) and if you spray on light coats until the desired texture is achieved, it can turn out looking great. I also liked the durability aspect and if you spray a matte/satin poly coat or 2 this would eliminate any uncomfortable peaks in the finish. On a tele body with a veneer of it on the headstock with a say a raised brass or chrome inlay of a motif or logo...it might look pretty sweet. Or maybe even some kind of chrome auto insignia. I just thought I'd throw it out there for anyone interested or would have any input on the subject. Thanks for all that this site does for the building comunity...Carry-on!

[Racer X]

How can anyone say that'll kill "tone?" What is tone? What's good tone? What can you add or subtract to make tone "good?" Those are hard questions to answer and almost impossible to quantify. I think it might be a painfull guitar to use, depending on what type of bed liner you use, but I think it would look cool and I doubt It'd have a negative effect on your guitar's sound if just sprayed on the body.

peace,

russ

Dude, the TONE is affected my the sum of all parts, and not just what pickups you have in it. That's why we have TONEWOODS. Trust me, it's not some b.s. story or conspiracy to jack the price of certain woods up, and doing that WILL kill his tone on that guitar. Don't believe me? Try it. You'll see what I'm talking about.

[GuitarGuy]

Dude, the TONE is affected my the sum of all parts, and not just what pickups you have in it. That's why we have TONEWOODS. Trust me, it's not some b.s. story or conspiracy to jack the price of certain woods up, and doing that WILL kill his tone on that guitar. Don't believe me? Try it. You'll see what I'm talking about.

Im doubting you have ever painted a guitar with bedliner. So how can you be so sure. When will people stop believing all this tone voodoo. Granted it may sound different. But you cant say with any sort of accuracy that the sound will be bad.

As fo me i give a big thumbs up to the unorthodox.

Edited October 4, 2006 by GuitarGuy

[thegarehanman]

***EDIT: Beat me to it, guitarguy. Anyhow...***

Dude, the TONE is affected my the sum of all parts, and not just what pickups you have in it. That's why we have TONEWOODS. Trust me, it's not some b.s. story or conspiracy to jack the price of certain woods up, and doing that WILL kill his tone on that guitar. Don't believe me? Try it. You'll see what I'm talking about.

I'm much happier trusting my experience rather than yours.

If he was spraying an archtop or acoustic with this stuff, I'd agree with you. However, I'd be agreeing on the basis of the physics of the instruments, not necessarily the woods. I can easily think of one instance where anyone with adequate experience will agree with my position: anything with EMG's.

As for "tonewoods," your vast experience should enlighten you about the fact that many woods used by guitar manufacturers are used sheerly for their economy, or even hype for that matter. The first teles were made from pine and some guys lust after them.

Take spalted and burled woods for example. Both have the "tonal" properties of high grade cardboard, yet both are widely used among guitar builders. Countless guys have plexi mirror topped guitars, hear any complaints from them? This coating is epoxy based and extremely hard, much harder than most "tone woods". Logic would lead one to the conclusion that this would potentially add sustain to the guitar. Now I can't prove this without the guitar existing, but you certainly haven't provided any reasons to disprove it.

peace,

russ

Edited October 4, 2006 by thegarehanman

[crafty]

How can anyone say that'll kill "tone?" What is tone? What's good tone? What can you add or subtract to make tone "good?" Those are hard questions to answer and almost impossible to quantify. I think it might be a painfull guitar to use, depending on what type of bed liner you use, but I think it would look cool and I doubt It'd have a negative effect on your guitar's sound if just sprayed on the body.

peace,

russ

Dude, the TONE is affected my the sum of all parts, and not just what pickups you have in it. That's why we have TONEWOODS. Trust me, it's not some b.s. story or conspiracy to jack the price of certain woods up, and doing that WILL kill his tone on that guitar. Don't believe me? Try it. You'll see what I'm talking about.

Okay, well:

MusicMan SubOne in textured finish

Carvin Bolt series with available textured finish

I guess EBMM and Carvin know nothing about tone...

[MP63]

I say try it. No one has, and until you do, you will NEVER know.

Rhino or Line-X is the only question.

One good thing...you won't need a case.

There was a company that used to build graphite guitars in Hawaii.

I'm sure that was thought to be weird, now graphite is the choice of neck reinforcement material.

You have taken the best advice and the reason for this forum and guitar building... to have fun.

[tasty]

I tell ya. I used spray on truckbed liner on my Beheringer FCB1010 pedal board and its killer. I wasn't really happy with the wussy look of the silver paint job...so I sprayed her down.

Just took off all the switches, buttons etc...and sprayed the chassis. Now its black with black buttons...really rugged and works excellent. That combined with a phantom power mod..and I am ready to rock.

[Daniel Sorbera]

Don't believe me? Try it. You'll see what I'm talking about.

Have you?

It doesn't matter what the discussion is about, if your telling people crap like that when you havn't done the testing either than you need to keep quiet on the matter, or express your opinions for what they are, only your opinions.

And if you indeed have, than please enlighten us with your results.

WILL kill his tone on that guitar.

Obviously manufactures that use thick polyester finishes sound like crap. PRS, Carvin, Fender, Gibson. Obviously they are the crappiest guitars on the planet because all of them have had the tone KILLED DEAD by crappy finishes.

BTW you can look at this the other way around. Have you ever played a guitar that was completely unfinished or had a thin wiped on finish? I have. And with the same thinking your applying here it should be the most amazing sounding holy grail tone ever. And you know what? It sounds exatly the same as the same guitar finished in thick poly finish. How would I know? Because I built TWO IDENTICAL GUITARS made from the SAME BOARD of wood. the only diffrence was one was finished in Tru-oil and the other in poly. ZERO DIFFRENCE IN TONE.

There you have it. Auctual research (as close as you are going to get in something like instrement making) And thats all I have to say on the subject.

Back on topic. The only problem I can see with using a bed liner is it would chew up your arm/hands. That stuff is pretty rough. It would be like putting sand paper all over your guitar. Not exatly good eats if you ask me. Though it is a good idea and I think it could look cool.

Edited October 4, 2006 by Godin SD

[Desopolis]

i didnt even think of the little spray cans.. I only use the heavy stuff..

if you feal like burning a body go for it.. Id love to see how it turned out..

I still cant imagine it though.. lol.

[egdeltar]

I have an Ampeg 8x10 that I have been thinking about ripping the rest of the tolex off and spraying it with some bedliner.

[Lord-of-the-strings]

Dude, the TONE is affected my the sum of all parts, and not just what pickups you have in it. That's why we have TONEWOODS. Trust me, it's not some b.s. story or conspiracy to jack the price of certain woods up, and doing that WILL kill his tone on that guitar. Don't believe me? Try it. You'll see what I'm talking about.

***EDIT: Beat me to it, guitarguy. Anyhow...***

I'm much happier trusting my experience rather than yours.

If he was spraying an archtop or acoustic with this stuff, I'd agree with you. However, I'd be agreeing on the basis of the physics of the instruments, not necessarily the woods. I can easily think of one instance where anyone with adequate experience will agree with my position: anything with EMG's.

As for "tonewoods," your vast experience should enlighten you about the fact that many woods used by guitar manufacturers are used sheerly for their economy, or even hype for that matter. The first teles were made from pine and some guys lust after them.

Take spalted and burled woods for example. Both have the "tonal" properties of high grade cardboard, yet both are widely used among guitar builders. Countless guys have plexi mirror topped guitars, hear any complaints from them? This coating is epoxy based and extremely hard, much harder than most "tone woods". Logic would lead one to the conclusion that this would potentially add sustain to the guitar. Now I can't prove this without the guitar existing, but you certainly haven't provided any reasons to disprove it.

peace,

russ

Zing

[Racer X]

Talk about a bunch of haters. Sheesh. Have I painted a guitar using bedliner? No. Have I painted a guitar, whereas it affected the tone? Yes. Have I painted a bedliner with that stuff? Yes. And I know that the stuff is dense, and deadens noise. Why? Because if it's density and consistency. It cut down on the VIBRATIONS. And that's what it's gonna do to a guitar. Someone painted a pedalboard with it, and liked it: Great. You don't count on the tonal resonance of your pedalboard, for your sound.

Hey, if he wants to try it, let him try it. Hell, why don't you guys try it. I was trying to help the guy out, and you jump on ME with such attitudes? So WHAT if I haven't painted a guitar with it. I know what the properties of the stuff are, and it's not what I would want on my guitar. Maybe YOU do.

Edited October 5, 2006 by Racer X

[doug]

WOW WOW WOW...

I say go for it. Or, get some wood and test it. Not for sound of course but how it feels. Then, if it's acceptable shoot the body with light coats. Now there are paints available that have very similar look, but would go on much thinner. Just a thought.

As for tone, well there is something to be said for the effect woods have in the overall tone. I'm sure it's no surprise to you.

Who's to say it won't sound good? Will it, won't it? Guitars made of all sorts of things sound good to someone. Is the way it sounds everything, or is the satisfaction of doing something different just to look at worth more to you?

There are guitars with the pickups isolated from the the body completely so as not to introduce any "body" coloration. Is this wrong? Does it sound "bad"? Likely it sounds different. Is different a bad thing...?

-Doug

[fryovanni]

How can anyone say that'll kill "tone?" What is tone? What's good tone? What can you add or subtract to make tone "good?" Those are hard questions to answer and almost impossible to quantify. I think it might be a painfull guitar to use, depending on what type of bed liner you use, but I think it would look cool and I doubt It'd have a negative effect on your guitar's sound if just sprayed on the body.

peace,

russ

Dude, the TONE is affected my the sum of all parts, and not just what pickups you have in it. That's why we have TONEWOODS. Trust me, it's not some b.s. story or conspiracy to jack the price of certain woods up, and doing that WILL kill his tone on that guitar. Don't believe me? Try it. You'll see what I'm talking about.

I couldn't agree with Russ more. I see "Tone Killer" and I figure the person making the statement doesn't know what they are talking about(which may or may not be the case). The Tone of an instrument is effected by the sum of its parts, how it is played, and in the case of electrics the amp,speakers, room etc.....We have "Tonewoods" because most people don't know enough about "wood" to know what to choose or how to properly prepair it for use.

Talk about a bunch of haters. Sheesh. Have I painted a guitar using bedliner? No. Have I painted a guitar, whereas it affected the tone? Yes. Have I painted a bedliner with that stuff? Yes. And I know that the stuff is dense, and deadens noise. Why? Because if it's density and consistency. It cut down on the VIBRATIONS. And that's what it's gonna do to a guitar. Someone painted a pedalboard with it, and liked it: Great. You don't count on the tonal resonance of your pedalboard, for your sound.

Hey, if he wants to try it, let him try it. Hell, why don't you guys try it. I was trying to help the guy out, and you jump on ME with such attitudes? So WHAT if I haven't painted a guitar with it. I know what the properties of the stuff are, and it's not what I would want on my guitar. Maybe YOU do.

No haters here fella. Actually guys that care enough to try to make sure a guy asking for advice gets a good answer. I am sure your intensions are good, and you are trying to make your point.

Wood like any other material you can use to build an instrument has properties that effect how it transmits vibration. Elasticity, density, grain orientation, internal friction (water,oils,resins,temperature), defects---Check this link and read over the section on vibration properties-Click. If you are interested here is a link with a wealth of free publications-clicky

Finishes need to control the rate at which humidity effects the wood as well as some physical protection. The negative effects of not protecting wood are going to be accelerated decay, more rapid and increased expansion and shrinkage, not to mention quicker changes to the woods internal dampening all due to rapid reaction to changing humidity. Not to even mention oils from hands, possible direct contact with liquids and so forth. If the finish first and formost meets the need for this protection. Then a secondary consideration may be the dampening effect(or potential) of heavy finishes. The fact that the body of an electric is not designed to be the primary producer of volume and sound as in acoustics. This is going to be a very very small factor(be the factor good or bad in terms of how it attenuates vibration).

Which brings me to dampening and attenuation. We choose woods that will dampen certain vibrations sothat we may be able to hear other frequencies better. We are not able to hear sounds equally. We have trouble with lower frequencies, and thus the presence of equally loud higher frequencies mask the present lower frequecies. A wood that is said to "produce" good lows has attenuated enough of the highs to allow us to hear the present lows. A wood that attenuates lows will sound harsh. So to get back on the finish subject. If that finish attenuates or dampens to some degree that may not actually be a bad thing at all. Anyhow.... I suppose I have yapped more than I should.

Rich

[tone seeker]

Well now...it seems that I have created a monster. I appreciate all the interest and input guys, but I didn't mean to kick up alot of dust. It's really cool how a Joe-Schmo like myself can ask a hypothetical question and in a very short time have a wealth of minds help tackle it. This is a great website and I'm looking forward to be part of it. I hope that we can all keep our egos and negativity in check, and encourage each other....(insert group hug smilie).

I decided for S&G's that I'll take an old POS S101 Charvel copy body and try it. It's a plywood piece of junk with a HH and 2 singles. After assembly and it has any hint of pleasing qualities(note: I didn't use the word-tone), then it might be plausable. It'll sorta be our little myth-buster experiment!

I really didn't want to waste an alder body and have it sound like dookie. I'll probably use a dark burgandy stain on it with possibly a nitro finish schedule. And I also decided that if the S101 sounds OK, then I would try one with poplar. Thanks again dudes and dudettes-Tone Seeker

Edited October 5, 2006 by tone seeker

[Racer X]

Hey, not your fault. You just asked a question, and I just tried to help out. It was the attitude that I got that I didn't appreciate. I don't respond well to smugness.

[crafty]

I don't respond well to smugness.

Are you kidding me?!?!