Mahogany Bolt-on Necks

[mikevirok]

Mahogany, while commonly used for set neck & neck through designs, is rarely seen on bolt-on designs. Warmoth offers bolt-on mahogany necks along with everything else in a bolt-on configuration, but I have rarely seen a manufacturer offer a production model with a bolt-on mahogany neck. Correct me if I am wrong on that observation, but based on the properties that I have observed mahogany as possessing would it be correct in assuming that a mahogany bolt-on neck is a bit too soft to hold up to the bolted-on strength requirements that less-soft woods commonly seen on production model necks have? Would the risk of using a mahogany bolt-on neck be that the screws would work a bit loose over time with applied tension from the strings? Sure, any bolt on neck can be prone to these weaknesses, but my question is if mahogany in general is just on that borderline of "yes" or "no" for bolt-on construction.

[WezV]

i think once its all put together it will be fine, but i wouldnt want to be removing the neck often as i feel this is when it will get more wear on the screw holes and weakening the join

[Bainzy]

I think it's probably more a tradition thing than a strength issue. If there really was such a problem with Mahogany, people would add bushings for the neck screws to be inserted into to remove any issues.

[komodo]

Interesting observation. Maybe inserts epoxied in, or the use of maple plugs might help out with strength.

[fryovanni]

For What its worth,

I don't believe the issues you mentioned(strength, or crushing strength*even Maple often has a steel plate to reduce this possibility) would be a reason not to use Mahogany. One thing that could be a motivator for larger factories is cost. Genuine Mahogany costs about twice what hard Maple costs, and is harder to source today. Some guitars pretty much have to be made with Mahogany and some with Maple because of tradition(what people expect). Mahogany certainly has different sound and feel. The bolt on joint is not a weaker or demanding joint per sey. Often set(glued necks) need to derive more glueing surface and thus heels and tenions come into play. The "weak link" so to speak in terms of strength on a neck is not in the heel. Also I would offer this, acoustic guitars typically have more tension because generally an acoustic "light" string set is a "heavy" string set on an electric(12's are lights on acoustics, 13's are med.). The vast majority of acoustics use Mahogany for necks. Genuine Mahogany also has better dimensional stability than Maple(although Maple is obviously plenty stable).

Peace,Rich

[Mattia]

Works fine - although you don't want to be screwing/unscrewing stuff all the time. Honestly, though, how often do you take the necks off your bolt-on neck guitars? If you're really worried, use threaded inserts. Works for acoustics, no problems.

[westhemann]

I have one of those warmoth mahogany necks on a sabre...works fine...it is certainly stiffer than the wizard neck I replced with it.

[crafty]

Taylor uses bolt-on mahogany necks with no problems. Just gotta use the right screw!

[Woodenspoke]

Mahogany is definitely softer than maple, so the answer really has been given. If you worry about the design use brass inserts and machine screws. The inserts have a wider thread giving you more surface area than a standard bolt on neck screw and you dont have to worry about stripping out the screw holes in the future.

[ray]

i put one on a blueshawk copy and its fine

i mean how many times do you need to take the neck off??

if you take it off there needs to be a good reason like its broken

if you taking ur neck off every other week you just foolin around

i got a tele i had since '83' and the neck off that has been off twice

once for refret and refinish [maple neck] once for major routing work on the body

both occaisions it was unavoidable

sure maple is tougher but screw a piece of mahogany onto a piece of wood with 4 neck bolts through a steel plate and see how easy it is to rip it off--------------it aint that easy

[soapbarstrat]

i mean how many times do you need to take the neck off??

if you take it off there needs to be a good reason like its broken

if you taking ur neck off every other week you just foolin around

Everytime I want to take one of my strats over-seas and put it inside a regular suitcase.

The threaded inserts come in real handy for that. For me, the inserts are worth putting in, even if the neck is only taken off once every ten years. Phil Jacoby once told me he would put them on all new guitars, if he were building them.

I have a couple mahogany bolt-on necks that I found. the wood is more flakey around the top of the screw holes than they would probably be if the neck was made of maple.

What you might not want is a guitar body that has more sustain than mahogany, then you bolt a mahogany neck on there and more string energy wants to die out in the neck instead of the body. But if you're a Gibson fan, maybe just the ticket

Edited July 25, 2007 by soapbarstrat

[jmrentis]

i mean how many times do you need to take the neck off??

if you take it off there needs to be a good reason like its broken

if you taking ur neck off every other week you just foolin around

Everytime I want to take one of my strats over-seas and put it inside a regular suitcase.

The threaded inserts come in real handy for that. For me, the inserts are worth putting in, even if the neck is only taken off once every ten years. Phil Jacoby once told me he would put them on all new guitars, if he were building them.

I have a couple mahogany bolt-on necks that I found. the wood is more flakey around the top of the screw holes than they would probably be if the neck was made of maple.

Ray, to add to that to what soapbarstrat said, I had imagined that much of this information for mikevirok is going toward building guitars for customers and figuring out what will work and what won't to avoid complications in customers parts failing. Being a builder you must assume that there will be a customer out there that will take the neck off 3 times a day to clean the pocket, LOL. It's just safer to make sure you won't have a neck wood that will strip should a customer take it off a number of times for whatever the reason. Anyhow, thats kinda what I got from the question, I don't think it was in regards to his personal instrument or his amount of neck disassembly. I could be wrong though, either way those inserts sound like a good idea, especially when selling custom bolt ons. J

[ray]

I take your point

selling a lot of guitars like that is not a problem for me so i look at it from my perspective of builds it - plays it

the idea of the threaded inserts has got me thinking though as I am a great advocate of bolt on necks

i guess the trick is making that neck sit dead straight when driiling the guide holes for the plugs

[mikevirok]

i mean how many times do you need to take the neck off??

if you take it off there needs to be a good reason like its broken

if you taking ur neck off every other week you just foolin around

Everytime I want to take one of my strats over-seas and put it inside a regular suitcase.

The threaded inserts come in real handy for that. For me, the inserts are worth putting in, even if the neck is only taken off once every ten years. Phil Jacoby once told me he would put them on all new guitars, if he were building them.

I have a couple mahogany bolt-on necks that I found. the wood is more flakey around the top of the screw holes than they would probably be if the neck was made of maple.

...I had imagined that much of this information for mikevirok is going toward building guitars for customers and figuring out what will work and what won't to avoid complications in customers parts failing. Being a builder you must assume that there will be a customer out there that will take the neck off 3 times a day to clean the pocket, LOL. It's just safer to make sure you won't have a neck wood that will strip should a customer take it off a number of times for whatever the reason. Anyhow, thats kinda what I got from the question, I don't think it was in regards to his personal instrument or his amount of neck disassembly...

Thanks J; I am looking at this from a builder/seller standpoint. My own personal preferences are now secondary to the customers' needs/wants. I'll be looking into the threaded inserts for my next builds.

[Mattia]

Inserts are easy enough to find - McMaster Carr, McFeelys, local mom and pop hardware store, heck, you can even do the easy thing and install T-nuts under the fingerboard, invisible but non-replaceable inserts, but make sure you also consider the fact attractive bolts may not be quite so easy to find. At least, I haven't seen oval philips head bolts with nice finishes (chrome, nickel, gold, black) of good quality anywhere. Local hardware place has nice stainless steel screws that would do the trick, but no bolts.

[soapbarstrat]

I thought you guys might get a slight chuckle out of this. This is word for word out of an older Dan Torres catalog. His pathetic attempt to get people to add some neck scews to their order :

" Fender Neck Screws - Did you know that EVERY TIME you tighten a screw it loses half of its Strength ? If you have been taking your neck off frequently, get some new ones ".

[jmrentis]

I thought you guys might get a slight chuckle out of this. This is word for word out of an older Dan Torres catalog. His pathetic attempt to get people to add some neck scews to their order :

" Fender Neck Screws - Did you know that EVERY TIME you tighten a screw it loses half of its Strength ? If you have been taking your neck off frequently, get some new ones ".

What you didn't know that?

[crafty]

Well, Dan Torres is "famous" for his shilling for EZ Wajcman, so the whole neck screw thing is hardly a surprise. Nothing like running your business on the "there's a sucker born every minute" philosophy.

[Woodenspoke]

Inserts are easy enough to find - McMaster Carr, McFeelys, local mom and pop hardware store, heck, you can even do the easy thing and install T-nuts under the fingerboard, invisible but non-replaceable inserts, but make sure you also consider the fact attractive bolts may not be quite so easy to find. At least, I haven't seen oval philips head bolts with nice finishes (chrome, nickel, gold, black) of good quality anywhere. Local hardware place has nice stainless steel screws that would do the trick, but no bolts.

Stainless now your talking bucks. There has to be some machine screws out there that would fit a standard neck plate insert combo, at least chrome plated ones. Maybe MSC has them.

Edited July 26, 2007 by Woodenspoke