MOJO Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 i though this came out so cool. i just had to pass it along... Ron Thorns latest " the navajo" particulars to take notice of 1) Wagner pickups with all koa bobbins 2) 3/4" inch koa top is inlaided and glued into the black limba back (not glued on top ) 3) a koa tonepros bridge and complete koa appointments ( won't find a stich of plastic on this guitar.. http://p092.ezboard.com/fthornnewsanddiscu...picID=192.topic Not sure how Koa fits in with the whole Navajo theme but thats what the owner wanted so.....still cool regardless Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Primal Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 I have no idea why, but I'm not diggin' the woods all the much. Maybe I'm just in a weird mood... Maybe its just a bit over done for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmrentis Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 Oh my goodness, that thing is insane. I never knew you could do half of the things he did on that guitar, inlayed whole bodies and headstocks, every piece seems to be from the original wood. That guy doesn't know the word waste when it comes to wood! Very unique and inspirational piece. Thanks for showing it here, it's a killer guitar. Jason Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j. pierce Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 Wow, that thing does look amazing. that inlay on the back of the neck - I've seen someting like it in one of the LMI catalogs - does anyone know how you go about doing something like that? I can't think of a convenient way to cut out the inlay slot on a curved surface like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jivin Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 I love the use of the wood in that guitar, but god! Those inlays... totally ruin it for me. Maybe its just photo (but i doubt it), but the colour just just doesn't work in nicely and shats all over what is a very very beautiful guitar - Dan Edit: Also, I cant beleive he inlayed the top... I didnt even know that was possible haha Very cool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrummerDude Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 I *LOVE* this guitar except for one thing - the colour of the inlays. I know that rock'n'roll requires flashy guitars but this one has gone way too far. The inlays are great but their colour simply doesn't fit the whole theme. They kinda look like the substance my grandfather uses to spray on to his vines - blue vitriol. Copper sulphate that is. Plus these bright inlays does not look good on the light coloured fingerboard. Everything else is killer, though! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skibum5545 Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 Well, the inlays are turquoise, the -absolute- standard for American Indian Jewelry and decorations, especially in the Southwest (Navajo was SW, no?), so in that respect, I see why he did it, and I actually kind of like it. Everything is well done, but for some reason the whole design just doesn't "click". Personally, I think the limba, colorwise, was a bad choice. He should have gone with a more orange wood like mahogany, or even more koa, to better complement the turquoise. After all, in the SW, -everything- is red sandstone, so it would fit the whole theme a lot better to have a redder wood. Just my $0.02. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ooten2 Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 Wow, what a beautiful guitar! I love everything about it! I'm into all things Southwestern, so I love the turquoise. And the darker wood at the first fret on the fretboard is cool. Great inlay work, and all the wood on everything, even the straplocks, is awesome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 . The inlays are great but their colour simply doesn't fit the whole theme. They kinda look like the substance my grandfather uses to spray on to his vines - blue vitriol. Copper sulphate that is. Plus these bright inlays does not look good on the light coloured fingerboard. Everything else is killer, though! are you serious? the theme of the guitar is OBVIOUSLY navajo inspired...and the navajo jewelry was heavy on the turqouise.. the inlay material and inlay design EXACTLY fits the motif of the guitar. i guess it's true,no matter what you do,someone will come through and poo poo it,even if they could never,ever come close to doing it themselves. don't mean to sound argumentative here,but maybe you guys should stop looking at it as if "well i would have done this" and start looking at it like "wow,i see what he was going for,and since it is not actually my guitar,i don't care that i have a prejudice against turqouise and inlays. but i think it is an absolute masters piece...i have never seen anything on this board to top the forethought,planning,and execution of it... i would say if anything does not fit the theme,it's the choice of hawiian koa and african limba....but that is only if you know where they come from...the look of the woods matches well...not to mention that wood choice will sound great Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maiden69 Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 I like Thorn guitars a lot, but this one over did the use of wood. Granted that it is a beautiful guitar, but I would be afraid to play that thing, it is like if played wrong it is goping to fall apart. Too much koa... the body and neck is OK, maybe the pup ring and the knobs, but TOM encased, the strap locks makes it redundant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thegarehanman Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 Screw everyone. Luthiery is an art, and this guy is quite an artist. I'm tired of people building 20 bare bones guitars(instead of one really nice one) with nothing but a block of wood and a pickup. Be creative for heavan's sake. Make something that will inspire people. Build something that someone could own and find something new they like about it every day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlGeeEater Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 Whoa, that is stunning! A true piece of beauty and art. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGM Guitars Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 . The inlays are great but their colour simply doesn't fit the whole theme. They kinda look like the substance my grandfather uses to spray on to his vines - blue vitriol. Copper sulphate that is. Plus these bright inlays does not look good on the light coloured fingerboard. Everything else is killer, though! are you serious? the theme of the guitar is OBVIOUSLY navajo inspired...and the navajo jewelry was heavy on the turqouise.. the inlay material and inlay design EXACTLY fits the motif of the guitar. i guess it's true,no matter what you do,someone will come through and poo poo it,even if they could never,ever come close to doing it themselves. don't mean to sound argumentative here,but maybe you guys should stop looking at it as if "well i would have done this" and start looking at it like "wow,i see what he was going for,and since it is not actually my guitar,i don't care that i have a prejudice against turqouise and inlays. but i think it is an absolute masters piece...i have never seen anything on this board to top the forethought,planning,and execution of it... i would say if anything does not fit the theme,it's the choice of hawiian koa and african limba....but that is only if you know where they come from...the look of the woods matches well...not to mention that wood choice will sound great ← I'm surprised at you Wes, that's a pretty arrogant statement to make i guess it's true,no matter what you do,someone will come through and poo poo it,even if they could never,ever come close to doing it themselves. I think Thorns work is great, but I don't like his guitars. I really don't like this one, I have to agree, the turquoise color doesn't fit, if the guitar was darker woods I'd have liked it more. Doesn't make it right or wrong, just makes it one mans opinion. I have all the respect in the world for Thorn, but at the same time, I wonder if he'd attempt a guitar like this without the CNC's that he runs. Nothing wrong with CNC, but he's done some pretty crazy stuff on this guitar that would be near impossible to do without a CNC. but i think it is an absolute masters piece...i have never seen anything on this board to top the forethought,planning,and execution of it... This quote is just insulting, not only to me but probably to many builders here. It's like saying that myself, Perry, Myka, etc etc etc don't even compare. I've seen guitars on here that IMO are far nicer, and I've seen builders on here every single bit as capable as Thorn, give them a CNC and I'm sure they could do anything just as well. Thorn has earned his reputation, no doubt there, and CNC is the logical progression in building guitars, when you can afford it, but to say nothing on this board can top the forethought, planning and execution??? I'm sorry but kiss my butt. The Leviathan's (love them or hate them) took me months to get where I was happy, and thousands upon thousands of dollars to create templates, jigs, drawings, and patent the design. I guess I didn't plan it or give it any forethought. In short, I don't like the guitar, not at all, but I respect the work and the builder behind the work, however, I think there are builders on this board capable of as good or better with or without a CNC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevan Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 Wes- You might want to re-think a couple of your lines there. I know you're still buzzing from some other events this past week, but... (the 'forethought' line) (the CNC line) Just do a decaf mocha latte frappachino and think about them for a minute. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guitarfrenzy Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 Wes- You might want to re-think a couple of your lines there. I know you're still buzzing from some other events this past week, but... (the 'forethought' line) (the CNC line) Just do a decaf mocha latte frappachino and think about them for a minute. ← I personally think that there are times when everyone words things wrong and get misunderstood. I don't think Wes meant any harm when he said that, I just think he was trying to make a point and got a little carried away. I understand how we all can be a little offended by his statement, but I honestly don't feel he thinks there aren't good guitar builders on this site. Oh my goodness I'm actually defending Wes.. lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gun Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 I like it. Cheers!!! Maybe I would go for metal knob but it looks great anyway. Gian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 Wes- You might want to re-think a couple of your lines there. I know you're still buzzing from some other events this past week, but... (the 'forethought' line) (the CNC line) Just do a decaf mocha latte frappachino and think about them for a minute. ← yeah you're right...but i did not mean it as an insult to the pros here...only that i truly think it is,in fact very well thought out and executed. but he's done some pretty crazy stuff on this guitar that would be near impossible to do without a CNC. ...are you saying it is cnc executed?if that's the case then forget what i said...i was assuming handbuilt,which would have been quite an accomplishment. lgm...why would you be insulted?if you are entitled to say your opinions about the color scheme,i am entitled to think it is quite a more complex work than your leviathan...considering i thought it was built by hand.the cnc just downgrades it to a great vision,i guess..if you had built a leviathon with all that inlay and little specialties,i would say the same thing...but that is not what your guitar is...your guitar is made to play but i guess i am more surprised by all these guys jumping in and saying negative things about it...i mean,it really is gorgeous and i think critisism only demeans those doing the critisizing. but no,it was only meant as a wake up call to those who may just be trying to find fault in order to make themselves look like experts. but i think in no way is it arrogant...it is not my guitar,and i freely admit it is much nicer than any of mine,obviously Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sepultura999 Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 A very beautiful piece. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 i guess i like it most because it gives me more new things to try on my own ... like that inlaid top...i am thinking about how to make a set of templates to accomplish that.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmrentis Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 like that inlaid top...i am thinking about how to make a set of templates to accomplish that.... On that note do you think it would be best to have the inlaid portion of the top angled in along the edges, with the body cut to accept this angle to give a tight fit. So it doesn't have 90 degree edges, because I think if you angled the tops edges inward, maybe with the top edge being 45 degress, you would get a stronger edge around the guitar, basically be a little thicker. Just an idea! Jason Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 i don't think it would matter,once it was glued either way would be as strong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GregP Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 That guitar is awesome, period. I'd play it. Too much wood for some people, sure, but isn't the title of the thread "For you Wood Nuts"? Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGM Guitars Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 Wes, Ron cut his teeth on hand building, he then built his own first CNC, that is why I have the utmost respect for him. But yes, his guitars are done with CNC in big part. There's nothing wrong with that, the insult I felt was when you said you have never "never seen anything on this board to top the forethought, planning and execution" I can't agree with that. Particularly when you consider certain members here such as Clavin who does his inlay 100% by hand, guitars like his "living sea" series, although not my taste, require more planning and visualizing for the inlay than most guitars require from start to finish. The Leviathan's are indeed meant to be played, but that doesn't mean I couldn't do one with a million different things similar to Ron's. I've done crazy inlays, crazy paint, exotic woods etc on a number of guitars, if a customer so desired I'd do them all on a Leviathan too, I guess I took things more personally than intended, but there are people on this board I hold to a higher level than Ron Thorn, not to take anything away from Ron, but he's not "the master" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whoofnagle Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 Personally, I think it is an amazing piece of work. It combines the vision of Ron's customer with the creativity of the builder. After reading LGM's post several times - I think he hit it on the nose. Ron did start by hand. He took a very common body shape and put his own twists on it. His use of the CNC allows him to cut the bodies in an extremely percise manner. I can't fault him for that, In fact, if you look at the pinned tutorial on CNC, you will see that he still spends quite a bit of hands on time with each guitar. Also, I think we have overlooked the time that it must have taken him to program that CNC to do this project or the time it took him to program his original pattern. Whether some builds a guitar completely by hand (non-CNC) or with a CNC I don't care. I have respect for either route. That Koa top is sick as well as the Limba!! Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westhemann Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 Particularly when you consider certain members here such as Clavin who does his inlay 100% by hand, well you got me there...clavin is amazing I guess I took things more personally than intended, but there are people on this board I hold to a higher level than Ron Thorn, not to take anything away from Ron, but he's not "the master" maybe so...i didn't say he was "the master"..i just said it was a "masters piece. you know the origin of that phrase,right?upon completing apprenticeship,the apprentice was required to make a "master's piece"...which was really nothing more than the best work he could do,proving that he was qualified to take the title "master" just because i believe the guy is a master of his craft,that does not make him "the" master,and does not take any credit away from anybody else. i will admit it...i think i am impressed more by the quality of his work than anything else...cnc or no,that is one fine work of art. so what?i still am sure i would prefer to play my kxk v... but that guitar of thorn's is visually stunning...and i guess i just wonder how anyone can voice negativism about it... it just seems like sour grapes,you know?like they are saying "aww,well it's nice and all,but the turqoise just ruins it for me...so it's not THAT great" don't you ever feel as if some guys are just looking for something to critique,when they should be complimenting and taking away ideas? constructive criticism is one thing,but critiquing a personal choice,such as light woods over dark woods,or turqoise inlays over mother of pearl,wood knobs and tuning pegs over metal...well,that is just,to me,the utmost of disrespect...as if the guy is being robbed of artistic merit. if i see a messy glue line or orange peel,or if i think the neck wood choice is problematic on a guitar,i will be the first to bring it up,in hopes that the next time the builder will do better. but what is accomplished by saying the turqoise ruins it?does anyone think on his next guitar he should shy away from being different so that he can conform to the majority opinion? how do you feel when someone says "well jeremy,i think the workmanship is nice,but i don't like pointy guitars,so i have to take away for that"(i know you have heard that one) my point is to enjoy the diversity and the originality of the instrument,not take away because it is not what you ,personally would do just because i like this thorn guitar does not mean that yours are not nice... but you have to admit...if a customer comissioned you to do a leviathan with the same options,and it turned out to be as nice,you would be upset to hear the same negative things about the color of your inlay. so you can't agree with my opinion?what's wrong with that...[brooklyn voice]you want we should always think alike?[end brooklyn voice] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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